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Mr. STALKER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. What was the first intimation you had, or first idea grasped by you, that that might result in a complete revolution of the Government?

Mr. STALKER. I think it was other than this. I had formed a conjecture of that kind a day or two earlier from some little matters that I had observed that I could not interpret the meaning of any other way. I refer now to the fact of being in one or two hardware stores in town and seeing ------

Senator GRAY. Was that on Monday?

Mr. STALKER. This was Monday, and possibly as early as Saturday observing some citizens getting fixed ammunition, cartridges—saw a number of citizens come in and rather quietly procure ammunition and go out with it.

The CHAIRMAN. Then you began to think that they would have use for that ammunition in some emeute or disturbance that was to take place?

Mr. STALKER. I began to regard that as a possibility. I knew nothing but what I saw, and began to wonder why there were so many citizens wanting fixed ammunition.

The CHAIRMAN. And it was not until Monday, if I gather your recollection about it, that you discovered there was an actual and combined movement in that direction?

Mr. STALKER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. About how many persons do you think were at the meeting which you mentioned as having taken place in Honolulu on Monday?

Mr. STALKER. Twelve hundred or 1,400.

The CHAIRMAN. Did it seem to be an intense meeting in its exhibition of feeling?

Mr. STALKER. A good deal.

Senator GRAY. You, yourself, were at the meeting?

Mr. STALKER Yes.

Senator GRAY. There were other tourists, like yourself, who helped to make up that number?

Mr. STALKER. Yes; I might say I saw people there from our hotel.

The CHAIRMAN. Speeches were made and resolutions adopted?

Mr. STALKER. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. Were there demonstrations of applause and cheering about the meeting?

Mr. STALKER. Applause and cheering were pretty vociferous at the time the speeches became of a rather sensational and exciting nature.

The CHAIRMAN. You have seen assemblages of that kind—not that kind particularly, but many public assemblages—would you say from your observation that that was an enthusiastic and strongly exciting, intense meeting?

Mr. STALKER. I can hardly say that they were intensely excited. It was a pretty enthusiastic meeting; a good deal of vociferous cheering greeted the speakers, but there was no excitement, no disturbance.

The CHAIRMAN. Did the meeting impress you with the idea that there was a resolute purpose to carry out the end?

Mr. STALKER. Yes; it did.

The CHAIRMAN. What was that end, as you gathered it from the meeting; what was the purpose they had in view?

Mr. STALKER. I believed then, for the first time, certainly that a

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revolution was in contemplation, although that was disclaimed in the speaking.

The CHAIRMAN. In the speeches was it stated, or did you understand it to be advocated as an attitude of the meeting, that in the event they could get a guaranty of their constitutional rights they would not overthrow the Queen or revolutionize the Government?

Mr. STALKER. As I recall it there was no policy, no promise of anything outlined. It was rather a declamatory style of speaking, in which the existing Government was severely criticised, different speakers saying: "We are not here as revolutionists, but to talk about grievances." I can not recall a single speech where so much as a single word was said about changing the form of the Government. I can not recall anything of the kind.

The CHAIRMAN. And yet you were conscious all the time that that would be the result?

Mr. STALKER. Yes; when I went to my hotel immediately after the meeting I said to some of my friends, "There will be an attempt at revolution here inside of three days;" I was laughed at.

The CHAIRMAN. Suppose that the Hawaiian people had been left to settle this matter in their own way, without the intervention of the United States or any other country, could you state it as your opinion that the popular demonstration which you witnessed at that meeting and the persons who were engaged in it and the purposes which actuated them were sufficiently strong and the people were sufficiently powerful to carry their end against the real government? In other words, did you believe from all the surrounding circumstances that the revolution then inaugurated would be successful aside from the intervention of the United States?

Mr. STALKER. I am not prepared to say I believed the Hawaiian citizens who were most enthusiastic in this meeting would of themselves conduct a successful revolution; but I had been led to believe by some remarks of citizens that the men were coming from the Boston.

The CHAIRMAN. State what those remarks were, and who were the men who made them, and when they were made as well as you can remember.

Mr. STALKER. If I remember correctly, it was a friend of mine, a Mr. White, who was a member of the revolutionary party, a nice gentleman. He said to me on this day----

The CHAIRMAN. What day?

Mr. STALKER. I think this was Monday—"If you want to see some fun get up early to-morrow; there will be an end of Kanaka Government."

The CHAIRMAN. What time of day was that remark made to you?

Mr. STALKER. I have been trying to recall that, and I am not quite able to say whether this was in the forenoon or afternoon.

The CHAIRMAN. That was on Monday?

Mr. STALKER. Yes; I am sure this was on Monday.

The CHAIRMAN. Where were you when Mr. White made that remark?

Mr. STALKER. I met him on the street.

The CHAIRMAN. Do you remember whether it was before or after the the mass meeting which you attended?

Mr. STALKER. I can not say as to that.

The CHAIRMAN. You have stated what he said. Have you stated all or is there something else you wish to add?