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Senator Gray. It was not talked about?

Mr. McCandless. Oh, it was discussed, certainly.

Senator Gray. In what respect was it discussed?

Mr. McCandless. It was discussed in respect to what would be the attitude of the American minister.

Senator Gray. Was it thought his attitude would be sympathetic or unsympathetic?

Mr. McCandless. There were doubts about that.

Senator Gray. Were there any doubts that Mr. Stevens sympathized with the movement.

Mr. McCandless. Yes.

Senator Gray. Did you doubt it?

Mr. McCandless. It was doubted that much that we requested him, after we requested the troops to be landed, not to have them landed, for fear it would precipitate a crisis.

Senator Gray. Had you any doubt at that time in regard to Mr. Stevens's sympathies with this movement?

Mr. McCandless. I do not think there was any serious doubt in my mind about it, although I was one of the members who took the side that we would stand a better show on Monday afternoon not to have the troops landed.

Senator Gray. When did you want them landed?

Mr. McCandless. Well, I thought we had better be let alone. The idea prevailed that they had better be let alone, and when the crisis came he would land them himself.

Senator Gray. Then it was your idea it would be better not to have them landed? I see it stated here that the proposition of the committee was that they should be landed the next morning at 9 or 10 o'clock. When did you think they should be landed?

Mr. McCandless. I do not think there was a time stated. We thought it was better to let them stay there because the crisis would be precipitated.

Senator Daniel. What were you afraid of in that crisis?

Mr. McCandless. The Queen's forces.

Senator Daniel. That they would suppress the revolution?

Mr. McCandless. Yes; might attempt it.

Senator Daniel. Do you think they could do it?

Mr. McCandless. I do not think so.

Senator Daniel. Did you then think so?

Mr. McCandless. We did not think so Monday morning. Minister Thurston defied Marshal Wilson in his interview with him.

Senator Frye. But as I understand you the uncertainty was as to what effect the landing of the troops would have; whether it would encourage the Queen's troops?

Mr. McCandless. We did not know what effect it would have— encouragement or otherwise.

Senator Frye. The landing of the troops the last time had put Kalakaua on the throne, had it not?

Mr. McCandless. Of course in 1889 the movement was an intrigue that both Kalakaua and Mrs. Dominis were in, and they were taken by complete surprise.

Senator Frye. The troops had the aid of the King, the existing Government?

Mr. McCandless. I can not say as to that.

Senator Frye. He remained on the throne, did he not?

Mr. McCandless. That movement in 1889 was not to put him on the throne; he was on the throne.

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Senator Gray. Had you not heard before the meeting on Monday evening, if not at that meeting, that Minister Stevens would land the troops to protect American life and property, and that he would recognize that Provisional Government so soon as it had possession of the Government building?

Mr. McCandless. That he would recognize the Provisional Government whenever it was a government.

Senator Gray. That he would consider the Government—put it that way—when it had possession of the Government building?

Mr. McCandless. No; I do not think so.

Senator Gray. What did you understand?

Mr. McCandless. When we had the upper hand he would recognize us.

Senator Gray. What did you understand? Did you not suppose during Monday or Tuesday that the presence of the United States troops was the important factor one way or the other? or do you mean to say that you gave no account to it at all?

Mr. McCandless. I say it had its bearing. It stopped all ideas of riot and bloodshed.

Senator Gray. Did you not think it stopped all idea of your movement?

Mr. McCandless. I do not think so. Our movement was weaker Monday morning than Monday evening.

Senator Gray. Do you not think the landing of the United States troops stopped all idea of the movement?

Mr. McCandless. On their part?

Senator Gray. I am not talking from a standpoint one way or the other. It is quite possible from what you say if I had been there I would have been where you were. I am not criticising you. But as a matter of fact, looking at it, state, under the responsibilities you are under as a witness, if you did not believe that the idea of your movement was entirely dissipated by the presence of the United States troops?

Mr. McCandless. No; I do not think so.

Senator Gray. You think it would have been precisely as it was if there had been no troops there at that moment of time?

Mr. McCandless. If you take into consideration the movement of 1887, how we won then, and could have set up a government, and the whites taken by surprise in 1889, yet maintained their supremacy----

Senator Gray. You supported the existing government in 1887?

Mr. McCandless. We did not support them in 1887. Of course, there was a complete overthrow of the monarchy.

Senator Gray. Did it continue?

Mr. McCandless. Yes.

Senator Frye. In view of those facts—you were going on to say?

Mr. McCandless. In view of those facts we had the same amount of confidence that any man had who had been through the same thing, and there was no reason why we should not win again.

Senator Frye. You were going on to state how they formed this provisional government. You got the notice to Dole and notice to Cecil Brown and stated that they were awaiting replies.

Mr. McCandless. Of course Mr. Brown left. We did not expect him to go in after that. And then we began to pick out the members for the advisory council. I think we agreed that night on the executive council—the four ministers—and we selected most of the names for the advisory council. We probably stayed there until 11 or half past 11 o'clock, and then adjourned until the next morning.