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is the main street [indicating]. This [indicating] is a narrow street, not much frequented.

Senator Gray. What sort of fence is there?

Mr. Laird. A picket fence on this side and a picket fence on both sides. There was a roadway that came down there from the opera house, and the Japanese commissioner lived in this house [indicating], so that we did not encroach upon his territory at all.

Senator Gray. There was a picket fence here [indicating]?

Mr. Laird. Our province was a little beyond the building itself.

Senator Gray. And the lot in which you were stationed was inclosed by a picket fence?

Mr. Laird. A picket fence, probably 4 or 5 feet in height.

Senator Gray. There was no disturbance that afternoon, Tuesday, after the proclamation of the Provisional Government, and around in the neighborhood of where you were?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. Around the Government building?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. Were you in a place to have seen it if there had been?

Mr. Laird. After the drill was over I walked out in front, in the roadway, to see if there was any assemblage of people.

Senator Gray. Were you aware that the proclamation was being read?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. You did not see any of it?

Mr. Laird. Did not see it and did not know it.

Senator Gray. Until you were told?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. There was no disturbance there?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Frye. Was there any difficulty that night about finding quarters for your troops?

Mr. Laird. There must have been great difficulty, or the men would not have been kept out until half past 9.

Senator Frye. Were there men out seeking quarters?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Frye. And you did not get them until 9 o'clock?

Mr. Laird. It was later than that.

Senator Frye. Do you know whether Arion Hall was selected with any reference at all to the Queen's Government or Provisional Government?

Mr. Laird. I have no such knowledge. I do not think it was. It was accidental—it was available.

Senator Frye. And the only one, so far as you could find out, that was available? Was there anything in the location or disposition of the troops which prevented the Queen's troops from dislodging the men who took possession of the Government buildings?

Mr. Laird. No, I do not think there was.

Senator Frye. Under your orders, if the Queen's troops had undertaken to repossess themselves of the Government buildings, had you any right to interfere?

Mr. Laird. I would have been obliged to obey Mr. Swinburne's orders.

Senator Frye. I say, under the instructions?

Mr. Laird. Under the instructions, no.

Senator Frye. In Mr. Blount's report he states that the Queen's

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troops could not have done anything touching the Government buildings really without firing upon the American troops.

Senator Gray. Quoting Admiral Skerrett for that opinion.

Senator Frye. No; I do not think Admiral Skerrett gives that as his opinion.

Mr. Laird. I do not see how we could interfere in any way with the Queen's forces or Government forces.

Senator Frye. I do not, from the maps, if the maps are correct. Did you at any time while you were there learn the extent of the Queen's troops and the Queen's police?

Mr. Laird. No, I did not.

Senator Gray. Did you intend to allow any fighting over across the street from you?

Mr. Laird. I was under the immediate orders of Lieut. Swinburne at the time, and I would have been obliged to obey his instructions. I could not use my own judgment; he was the senior officer.

Senator Gray. How long did you stay on shore?

Mr. Laird. We were on shore from the 16th of January until the 1st of April.

Senator Gray. How far was Camp Boston from the landing place?

Mr. Laird. It was right in the heart of the city itself.

Adjourned until to-morrow, 11th instant, at 10 o'clock a. m.


Contents

Washington, D. C., January 11, 1894.

The subcommittee met pursuant to adjournment.

Present: The Chairman (Senator Morgan) and Senators Butler, Gray, and Senator Dolph of the full committee.

Absent: Senators Sherman and Frye.

SWORN STATEMENT OF JAMES H. BLOUNT.

The Chairman. What time were you first informed of your selection by the President as the Commissioner to go to Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. The first intimation I had on the subject of my going to the Hawaiian Islands is contained in this dispatch, which I read:

"Washington, D. C., March 10,1893.
"Hon. James H. Blount,
Macon, Ga.:
"By authority I ask can you come here immediately prepared for confidential trip of great importance into Pacific Ocean? Answer."

The Chairman. Was that signed by Mr. Gresham?

Mr. Blount. No; by Hoke Smith.

The Chairman. You came in accordance with that request?

Mr. Blount. Yes. And if you will allow me I would say when I first got the telegram I made up my mind very promptly that I would not go; I did not want to go at all. My son opened the dispatch and found out what it was, and in that way was induced to bring it up to my house. I was at home. He asked me what I was going to do about it, and I said I was not going. I then showed it to his mother, and told her that I was not going. After some little while my son said, "Father, mother's health is very bad, and I think it would add five years to her life to go;" and under that appeal from him I said, "I will do anything for your mother's benefit; I will go." I then sent

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a telegram. I do not recollect its purport. I meant to give them to understand that I would come on to Washington.

The Chairman. When you came here you were informed of the place to which you were to be sent and the nature of your mission?

Mr. Blount. When I got here I went to see Mr. Hoke Smith, the Secretary of the Interior, and we went over to see the President, to pay my respects. I learned from Mr. Smith, not from the President, that the object in sending me over to the Hawaiian Islands was to make an investigation in regard to the revolution.

The Chairman. At that time did you have any prepossessions in regard to the condition of affairs in Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. You had formed no fixed opinions about it?

Mr. Blount. No. Two years ago, when I was chairman of the Committee on Foreign Relations of the House of Representatives, Mr. Thurston, with Mr. Mott Smith, came to the committee room and wanted to know if the Democratic party would consent to the annexation of the Hawaiian Islands. I said to him, without telling him my reasons, "You had better see the Secretary of State about it."

The Chairman. Was that while John W. Foster was Secretary of State?

Mr. Blount. I do not know. I think he was not at that time.

The Chairman. Blaine then was Secretary of State?

Mr. Blount. Blaine. Did I say Foster?

The Chairman. No; I asked if Foster was Secretary of State.

Mr. Blount. He said to me, "I am a member of the Legislature and I mean to endeavor to bring about the annexation of the islands." Mr. Smith heard it. I said nothing at all; I had no authority at all from anybody on the subject, and I did not think I ought to be talking, especially to a gentleman who came in there talking about a movement of that sort. I thought he was a pretty uppish sort of person, and thought no more about it. Mr. Foster sometime in the month of February showed me a letter from Mr. Stevens, of November 20.

Senator Gray. November 20, 1892?

Mr. Blount. I think that was the date. I saw the newspaper accounts, and I was a little apprehensive; I thought there might be something wrong. But I had no idea about the condition of things at all

The Chairman. Has that letter been printed ?

Mr. Blount. Yes. The opinion that I reached was developed by events after I got there.

The Chairman. Got to Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. Yes. I was never more determined to be careful and hear the truth than I was on that occasion. The situation I was in was rather painful to me. I met those people on one side and the other with a great deal of freedom. It was important for me not to take any position one way or the other, because the most simple thing I might say would be likely to be construed as significant; so that I was left without anybody to consult, and it made my progress very slow. For some weeks in my house there was not fifteen minutes interval that there was not somebody there, from the time I got my breakfast until bed time at night—people of the several political parties; all were as cordial and as courteous as they could be.

Senator GRAY. On both sides of this question?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. YOU were visited by the native population of Hawaii? I call them the Kanakas.

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Mr. Blount. Yes. I was visited by all. I felt I was there to make an investigation, and I thought it was my duty to see the people.

The Chairman. Did they come there voluntarily to see you, or did you send out for them?

Mr. Blount. They came voluntarily. The truth of it is, it got to this point that I commenced to take testimony, and I was so much interrupted that I saw that it was necessary for me to fix a time for work and the time when I would see anybody. So that I refused to see anybody except the Government officials until after 2 o'clock each day.

The Chairman. We will get back to the starting point of this matter. When you saw the President did you have any conversation with him about the objects of your mission to Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. NO, not especially. He seemed to understand that I was there for the purpose of making the investigation.

The Chairman. My question referred to the President of the United States.

Mr. Blount. Repeat the question.

The question was read as follows:

"When you saw the President did you have any conversation with him about the objects of your mission to Hawaii?"

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. Did the President undertake to inform you of his opinions in regard to the situation in Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. Not in the slightest degree. And I never had at that time nor after I left any intimation as to what the President thought about it or felt. I was impressed with the belief that he wanted information.

The Chairman. Did he intimate or indicate in any way whether he was in favor of or opposed to the annexation of the islands?

Mr. Blount. Not in the slightest. On the contrary, he said to me— just a casual thing—"I understand from Mr. Springer that the Democrats in the House of Representatives are inclined to favor annexation." Seemed to be an inquiry. I said "I think Mr. Springer is in error about that; my impression is that the feeling in the House is that the members are not satisfactorily informed." He seemed, then, as though he had made a mistake, and said, "I ought not to have mentioned that," and he never said anything more. The impression made on my mind was that he was afraid he might give me some impression of his opinion or inclination.

The Chairman. Was that impression changed in any communication that you had with him at any time before you went to Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. Never.

The Chairman. From whom did you receive your instructions as to the mission you were to perform?

Mr. Blount. From the Secretary of State.

The Chairman. Were the instructions in writing?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. Are they set forth in your report?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. Did you receive from the Secretary of State any instructions except those that are in writing?

Mr. Blount. I did not.

The Chairman. That, then, was the limit and the bound of your authority and course in Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. Yes. I might, perhaps, say that the Secretary of State expressed the opinion that there was no principle of international law

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that he thought justified the hoisting of the American flag—the establishment of an American protectorate there, and his idea was that it ought not to be continued.

Senator Dolph. That it ought not to be continued?

Mr. Blount. Ought not to be continued. But I understood from him that that was a matter largely in my discretion. There was no desire to make any change if it involved bloodshed. I took the impression generally that the opinion of the Secretary of State was that the flag had better be removed, if it was feasible to do it.

The Chairman. Did you receive, from the Secretary of State any orders or directions based upon his view of the merits or demerits of the revolution which was alleged to have taken place in Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. The opinions he expressed to you, as I understand, had reference to the matter of raising the flag and removing the protectorate over the islands?

Mr. Blount. Yes; that was the extent of it.

The Chairman. That your commission—did you have a regular commission?

Mr. Blount. I think that appears in the President's communication.

Senator Gray. Your letter of appointment?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Gray. It was not a regular commission, was it?

The Chairman. Was there anything beside that letter?

Mr. Blount. Let us see what paper was there?

Senator Gray. The paper will speak for itself.

The Chairman. I did not know that it had gotten in the report.

Senator Gray. It will speak for itself, if there be nothing beside that.

Mr. Blount (referring to his report). This recites that on the 11th of March, 1893, I was appointed special commissioner to the Hawaiian Islands with instructions. These are the papers, and I guess you have the instructions in there.

The Chairman. Had you any commission independently of this?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. Did you take any oath of office?

Mr. Blount. I do not think I did—not as commissioner; I took the oath of office as minister.

The Chairman. That was later?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. I will come to that after awhile. Now, at the time you left here the Senate was in session, what we call executive session, rather at the time you got your appointment?

Senator Gray. We know that. It was in session from the 4th of March or 5th of March, was it not?

The Chairman. Yes. Now, state whether it was your purpose to confine yourself in your operations in Hawaii in the execution of this commission of the President to the instructions you received, having reference, of course, to the discretion which was confided to you in respect to those orders.

Mr. Blount. It was not only my purpose, but I did it as rigidly as I ever did anything in my life.

The Chairman. Was your judgment, which you have given, your opinion here in your report in regard to the situation of affairs in Hawaii, and the regularities or irregularities that attended the conduct of the minister of the United States in connection with that revolution in any wise influenced by your desire either to promote or to prevent or retard the annexation of Hawaii to the United States?

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Mr. Blount. I would hate to think so. I had the idea that I was to conduct myself in decency and pursue the inquiry with fidelity.

The Chairman. The question is asked you to enable you to give an affirmative answer.

Mr. Blount. Well, I will say no. What is the question?

The question was read as follows:

"Was your judgment which you have given, your opinion—your report in regard to the situation of affairs in Hawaii and the regularities or irregularities that had attended the conduct of the minister of the United States in connection with that revolution—in any wise influenced by your desire either to promote or to prevent or retard the annexation of Hawaii to the United States?"

Mr. Blount. I am not conscious of any such feeling. On the contrary, I was impressed when I came to the investigation with the conviction that I had very much at stake. I had confidence in the integrity and high purposes of the President, and felt that I could give him no higher offense than to misinform him. I felt that any other than a truthful, an exhaustive, and impartial examination would bring about the contempt of the American people. I was, therefore, timid— over cautious, perhaps, in all my conduct in reference to it. I kept from their social life. I did not intimate any opinion to these people one way or the other. When I left those islands nobody had any idea, so far as I could gather, what my report was. Each side claimed in the newspaper that I was in favor of it. I studiously avoided communicating anything to anybody, and I turned the facts over and over again in my mind. I felt that I was alone, without anybody on earth to consult with, counsel with, and I often felt the need of somebody to advise with. But there was no impartial person to whom I could talk at all, and so the responsibility I felt the greater, and went on in that groove to the end.

Senator Gray. Was party feeling running high there?

Mr. Blount. Very high, very high.

The Chairman. You seem to have taken some of the testimony submitted to you upon oath, and other parts are without being sworn to. Did you administer the oaths to these witnesses yourself or did you have it done by the authorities of the islands?

Mr. Blount. I had no authority to administer an oath. It was a very delicate thing for an American to call upon those people to take an oath, especially members of the Provisional Government, and wherever I had the time I would take the testimony down in shorthand, and had the stenographer write out the shorthand and the witness certify to its correctness. I used him, the stenographer, all I could in that way. The communications would come in; some of them I did not think much of, and some I did. There was no opportunity to cross-examine.

Senator Gray. Any written statements?

Mr. Blount. Written statements, yes. I did not like very much to take them. It occurred to me, I am down here, I can take these things and weigh them; I shall know all about the parties and topics and if they are not pertinent I can discard them; and when I came to make up my report I said, all these things have been here with me; I will put them in this testimony and let all go along. The statements were sometimes from one side and sometimes from another.

The Chairman. Not being authorized to administer an oath yon received such statements as they brought to you?

Mr. Blount. They would hand them to me, and I would take them and look at them.

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Now, Mr. Chairman, there is one statement that this observation does not apply to, and as you have invited my attention to the matter I think it proper to say this. You will find a statement there in the form of a colloquy between W. O. Smith and Mr. Cooper and Mr. Cassell. The circumstances about that I wish to state. On one occasion I said to the President and members of his cabinet, "I would be very glad to have the statement of you gentlemen at any time if it is agreeable to you."

The Chairman. You are referring now to President Dole and his cabinet?

Mr. Blount. Yes. "I can conceive of reasons why you might not desire to do it." I did not state what they were, and they made no response and gave no indication of a desire to be examined. The attorney-general---

The Chairman. Who was he?

Mr. Blount. W. O. Smith. He came one day, as he did often, to the house where I stopped, and I said to him, "I would like to examine you." He agreed to it.

Senator Gray. He agreed to it.

Mr. Blount. He agreed to it. The time came for him to be examined and he said, "I would rather not be examined. I will bring you a paper, which is the history of the revolution, prepared by myself and some other gentlemen, and I will hand that to you." He brought this paper. He said it contained most of the history of the revolution, some unimportant matters only were omitted. I said, "Would you object to my seeing those?"

Senator Gray. Seeing what?

Mr. Blount. The unimportant matters. It was something left out. He hesitated and said, "Well, I will speak to Mr. Dole about it." I afterwards mentioned it to him again, and he answered he had not. I think that was about it. I did not pursue the matter further. You can readily understand my relations to the Provisional Government; they were of very great delicacy. Mr. Cooper, another gentleman in this colloquy, I invited to be examined. He came at a time when somebody else was being examined. I was a good deal crowded by lack of clerical force, and said to Judge Cooper, "Won't you sit down and write me out carefully a statement of the facts of this revolution?" He said, "Yes." Well, he apologized for not doing it once or twice on account of his court. But this paper never came. He never alluded to the matter again.

The Chairman. Did he not bring the paper to you or send it to you?

Mr. Blount. Mr. Smith brought a paper.

The Chairman. After that Judge Cooper never made any statement to you?

Mr. Blount. Never made any statement.

The Chairman. I want to ask you whether opportunity was accorded by you to all the members of that Provisional Government to make their statements of the history of the transaction?

Mr. Blount. As I have already stated on my own motion, I said to the President and cabinet together, I would be very glad to examine you gentlemen.

The Chairman. And what you have put in your report is all you have received in reply to that suggestion?

Mr. Blount. Everything in the world.

Senator Butler. I see in some criticisms of the testimony which you have taken, quite severe attacks upon the character of some of the witnesses. Did you adopt the usual method of ascertaining the quality

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of the testimony, if I may use that expression, examine such witnesses as were available?

Mr. Blount. Before I examined any witnesses I received everybody, heard what everybody said, and saw a good deal of the people, and judged as best I might as to the character of the witnesses. You can readily see that with this statement I could not pursue the methods that I would pursue here. If I were to go into the matter of the examination of the witness, say of the royalist side, and his statement was made known to the public immediately, you would find an outcry perhaps in the press about treasonable purposes, about opposing the Government, etc. There was an intense amount of feeling, and therefore I could not, on the ground of these attacks, do as suggested. If they had not been made in the press, I knew these feelings existed. Whom could I call on to say would you believe this man on his oath? I never allowed, so far as I could govern it, any one to know whom I had examined. I never allowed an annexationist to know I had examined a royalist, and never allowed a royalist to know I had examined an annexationist. The secrecy of my examination was the only way in which I could make a full investigation.

Senator Butler. In other words, you availed yourself of the best testimony you could get under the circumstances?

Mr. Blount. I did.

The Chairman. The communications that were made to you, I understand from your statements, you kept entirely secret?

Mr. Blount. Nobody saw them until they were seen in this country, in this Capitol, besides myself and my stenographer.

The Chairman. I will ask you, in the disturbed state of affairs in Hawaii, whether it would or would not have been impracticable to have obtained a full statement, frank statement, about the participation of these men in the revolution on the one side or the other, because of an apprehension in certain events they might be held responsible by whichever Government proved to be the permanent Government?

Mr. Blount. Possibly so. I am quite sure that that was true in reference to the people who were not in power, and I rather think the President and cabinet preferred not to be examined, because of the changes that might occur. But I could not say that I could give you tangible, substantial reasons for it. It was that I had in mind—I did not tell them so—when I said, "I should like to have your testimony; I can conceive of reasons why you might not want to testify."

Senator Gray. Your feelings and theirs both were ones of delicacy?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. And on the other hand there might be apprehension in the change of government of criminal prosecutions, because of the information they might give to you?

Mr. Blount. What their reason was I might conjecture, and it would not, perhaps, be the correct one.

The Chairman. I was asking you what your conjecture was—an opinion was—on that proposition, and whether that made it necessary, in your judgment, that you should observe this very conservative course.

Mr. Blount. That is what guided me in my approaches to the subject.

The Chairman. When you got to Hawaii, to whom did you report, to what Government?

Mr. Blount. To the Provisional Government.

The Chairman. Did you exhibit your letter of authority to the Provisional Government?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. Did you inform the Provisional Government of the

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nature and purposes and extent of the commission and powers which you had been entrusted with in visiting the islands?

Mr. Blount. I did not.

The Chairman. What information did you give to President Dole?

Senator Gray. They were confidential, were they not?

Mr. Blount. They were confidential. You will see what the President communicated to me in the papers.

The Chairman. You gave no information to that Government of your instructions?

Mr. Blount. No, not for some time.

The Chairman. After a while we will get at what you did. But what you did then was, I suppose, to deliver the letter of the President of the United States to the President of the Provisional Government?

Mr. Blount. Yes. Well, I got to meeting them in a casual way, and there would be references to the examination, but no discussion of it. My time was taken up in making examinations.

The Chairman. How far did you put the Provisional Government in possession of knowledge of your authority as commissioner to the Hawaiian Islands?

Mr. Blount. I never gave them any information in reference to the matter—I mean direct, official communication—until I published the instructions that I was acting under.

The Chairman. When did you publish those instructions?

Mr. Blount: That appears in the correspondence with the State Department. I have not seen it for six months.

The Chairman. Did you publish them in the newspapers?

Mr. Blount. All the newspapers of Honolulu.

The Chairman. What was your object in making public those instructions?

Mr. Blount. All sorts of conjectures as to what my powers were and the purposes of the Administration through me. For instance, there would be a claim on the part of the royalists that I was going to restore the Queen at a certain time; and on the other hand there would be a declaration on the part of the annexationists after the troops were ordered back to the vessel, on the appearance of any disorder I would bring them back for the purpose of suppressing it. The impression was that I would not allow a move of any political party there looking to a change of the Government, and I felt it to be my duty to inform those people, both sides, that I was not there to take any part either with one party or the other with reference to their affairs; that I should protect American citizens in their lives and property while they were observing the laws of the land and not participating in the conflict.

The Chairman. In order to give confidence and assurance to the people of Hawaii in the midst of these conjectures that were being made, you thought it was best to publish your instructions?

Mr. Blount. I ought to say that I had corresponded with the Secretary of State about these misapprehensions, and he authorized me in my discretion to publish them, and I did it promptly.

The Chairman. In what way were you received by the Provisional Government, in a friendly or in a reluctant way?

Mr. Blount. As friendly as I could desire or anybody could desire.

The Chairman. Did the President of the Provisional Government indicate to you that you were welcome in Hawaii as the representative of the United States Government?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

The Chairman. Did you report to or have any official correspondence

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with Liliuokalani or her cabinet, or the cabinet that existed at the time of her abdication?

Mr. Blount. I never had any communication with her in any way until certain persons appeared there and were reputed to be authorized by the President to negotiate for her abdication. I think that is all printed.

Senator Gray. What is it?

Mr. Blount. Certain persons there claiming to have authority from the President of the United States to negotiate for the Queen's abdication.

The Chairman. Who were those persons?

Mr. Blount. I think their names appear in the printed papers—Dr. Bowen, correspondent of the New York World, and a Mr. Sewell.

The Chairman. It turned out that they had no such authority?

Mr. Blount. Yes. I thought the President of the Provisional Government and the Queen herself both ought to be informed that this was not true. I sent to Mr. Dole. I asked him to come to my house, which he did. I told him the circumstances, and that these gentlemen had no such authority. He said, "Well, would you object to its being stated you think the Queen's abdication would simplify the situation?" I said I would. I feel that I am authorized in saying that the Government of the United States has nothing to do with this matter one way or the other, and I had nothing to say for or against the measure. I had no authority from the Government, and until I had, did not want the name of the United States Government connected with it.

Senator Gray. If it could be brought about by the intervention of those gentlemen, without the United States Government having anything to do with it, you would have nothing to say about it?

Mr. Blount. No. Some hours after I called on Mr. Dole and said I have never called on the Queen; never called because I was afraid it would be misapprehended, misconstrued; because it was not proper conduct considering my relations to your Government. But I feel now that I ought to go to see her and say to her in connection with this matter what I have said to you. He said he could not see any impropriety in it. I went and stayed two or three minutes, making the same representation that I did to President Dole.

Senator Gray. The Queen speaks English?

Mr. Blount. She speaks English; but she evidently was very wary. She did not know what to make of me or the Government, and said very little. I left her. I did ask a member of her cabinet to inquire of her if she would not be willing to furnish me a copy of the constitution she proposed to proclaim.

Senator Butler. The one which was supposed to have been promulgated?

The Chairman. Promulgated and destroyed?

Mr. Blount. The one she proposed to promulgate. The answer was made she would do so. It was not done for a long while. I do not know why, but finally the paper was brought to me by some person, I do not know whom now. I sent for the members of the cabinet.

The Chairman. The Queen's cabinet?

Mr. Blount. Her cabinet. To see if they recognized that paper, and they agreed to all except one proposition. It contained a property qualification on voters for the legislative body, not nobles, but representatives, and they disagreed with her as to that.

The Chairman. Said that was not part of the paper as they understood?

Mr. Blount. Yes. They did not think there was any property

S. Doc. 231, pt 6----48

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qualification; they thought it was educational. I put it in my report because this man Peterson is a pretty bright lawyer, and I thought they would be much more likely to recollect correctly than the Queen. I never talked with the Queen about it at all.

The Chairman. That is all the information you got about the terms of the constitution which the Queen had proposed?

Mr. Blount. Except later. Sometime afterward a gentleman came to me, I think a Mr. Carter or a Mr. McFarlane, with a paper, which you gentlemen have here, containing a statement of the Queen; I looked over it. My first impression was that I ought not to use it; that she was disclosing a great many secrets in her feelings toward her political allies calculated to create feeling between her and them. She was a woman. Then it occurred to me after thinking the matter over, "I have nothing to do with that; I am here representing the Government of the United States, and I will put that with the other evidence." Those are all the communications on the constitution.

The Chairman. Did that paper purport to emanate from the Queen?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes; there is no question about that.

The Chairman. You say there is no question about that?

Mr. Blount. I have no question about that.

Senator Gray. Was that sent in with your report?

Mr. Blount. Yes; I have put everything in the bundle and sent it.

Senator Gray. You sent everything?

Mr. Blount. I sent everything.

Senator Gray. It is a statement signed by the Queen, is it?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Gray. There is but one statement from her, a sort of history of the revolution?

The Chairman. It was her version of the affair?

Mr. Blount. Her version. I never spoke to her about it at all.

The Chairman. During your stay in Hawaii did you have any official communication with Liliuokalani or her cabinet as in any sense representing an existing government?

Mr. Blount. No; not the slightest, not the slightest.

The Chairman. What communication you had with them at all was for the purpose of obtaining information that you thought would be useful to the Government of the United States?

Mr. Blount. Yes. I took opinions from both sides of people who were connected with public affairs at the time. For instance, if you will allow me, there was Mr. Damon, the Vice-President, who went to the station house to negotiate for the surrender of the station house, and went to the Queen. I took him, Mr. Bolte, who went with him to the station house; Mr. Waterhouse, who was on the committee of safety, and at whose house the final determination of the dethronement of the Queen occurred. I mention those persons, and I attempted to get the testimony of Mr. Smith and the statement of Mr. Cooper, who read the proclamation establishing the new Government; I went in that direction, and I found from Mr. Damon's testimony and Mr. Bolte's that they had gone to the station house and found certain persons connected with the Queen's Government, and I naturally took members of the cabinet, and so it led along as circumstances were.

The Chairman. As the question opened up to your mind you proceeded to investigate things that you thought would be useful to the Government here?

Mr. Blount. I did.

The Chairman. Before you left Hawaii did you receive any communication, statement, or information from the Government of the United

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States of any purpose to reinstate Liliuokalani on any terms or conditions whatever?

Mr. Blount. I never dreamed of such a thing as the reinstatement of Liliuokalani; I never heard it suggested until my return to the United States. I had a talk with the Secretary of State, and the inclination of his mind was that the circumstances created a moral obligation on the part of the United States to reinstate her. I gathered from the Secretary of State that the President had not any opinion—was thinking the matter over.

The Chairman. That the President had not formed his opinion?

Mr. Blount. Had not formed his opinion. I had never heard anything from the President indicating any opinion until the public had it.

The Chairman. Then at the time you left Hawaii nothing had been developed in the direction of a movement to reinstate Liliuokalani on the throne?

Mr. Blount. I never heard of it except as I heard of it in the American papers.

The Chairman. The papers that would find their way to Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. Yes; nothing from the Government. You asked me a moment ago about my having communication with the Queen. Those people down there are the most consummately brutal and unconscionable people I ever saw—on both sides; they say almost anything. On one occasion the attorney-general came to me at my office, and the Queen's name was mentioned. I said, "What sort of a person is she; I never saw her." He was surprised. He said, "You have never seen her?" I said, "No." He said, "That is very strange; the Government was informed that you called to see her, and she got on her knees, and pressed your hands, and cried," etc. Some time after that an attack was made in the Star, in which the writer was urging the deposition of the Queen, charged she was conspiring against the existing Government, and said she should be deposed, that she might have treasonable communications with public ministers, as witness her unhindered interviews with Commissioner Blount. That was the annexation organ. I thought it was very discourteous, and I wrote Mr. Dole a letter. Probably it appears in the published correspondence.

In that letter I set forth that I had never called upon the Queen at all except as indicated in an interview with him, in which it was agreed that there was no impropriety in my doing so, and that I felt this attack was an outrage on me as the American representative. He seemed to appreciate the situation, and an apology was brought about, a very poor one. But I think President Dole regretted it. The attorney-general, in referring to the article, said to me that this man Smith, of the annexation organ, had been to the Government (that is to say the President and cabinet), and said that he had the unquestionable proof that I had three long interviews with the Queen. He did not believe Smith. I never had any communication with the Queen looking to her protection or aid in any form.

The last interview I had with her came about in this way: I was going off from the islands; I made up my mind to leave; I thought everything was quiet. I felt I was taking some responsibility by leaving if anything should happen and I should not be there—that I would have to suffer the criticism. I talked with members of the Provisional Government; talked with some two or three gentlemen of character and standing on the royalist side as to whether there was any danger in my leaving, and then it occurred to me perhaps I had better go and see the Queen and ascertain just what she thought of the peacefulness of her people. I went to her and told her my purpose of leaving; all of which

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was kept quiet, because I did not want any demonstration made when I went away from there. It was understood by the Provisional Government. I talked to them freely about it.

I asked the Queen about the natives keeping quiet. She said there was no danger until the question of annexation was finally determined upon by the United States. She asked me, in the event of her arrest what would Admiral Skerrett do—what would the United States forces do in the way of protection. I said, "So far as I am concerned I must decline to answer as to what the Government of the United States will do; when I leave here Admiral Skerrett will be in command of the naval forces, and questions of public order, etc., will be left with him without my control." I never gave her an intimation.

Senator Gray. Is that all that occurred?

Mr. Blount. That is all that occurred.

Senator Gray. How many times had you had interviews with regard to public affairs with the Queen?

Mr. Blount. Had but two interviews; one concerning her abdication, and one just before I left, to see if there was danger of bloodshed when I left.

Senator Gray. The one you have just spoken of?

Mr. Blount. Yes. Those were the only conversations I ever had with her, and each of them I have substantially detailed.

The Chairman. In your estimate of her in those brief conversations, did you think her an intelligent, bright woman?

Mr. Blount. The conversations, I say, were very brief; the first one only two or three minutes, when she seemed to be a little wary and disinclined to talk except in response to questions. She was dignified and reserved. She was quite reticent. I had no means of determining her intelligence from any observation of my own. She was reputed by all the people there to be a very well educated woman.

The Chairman. A woman having dignity?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

The Chairman. Having polite manners?

Mr. Blount. Yes. That is quite a feature of the Hawaiian people— dignity and good manners. So I learned from the people over there.

The Chairman. Was that your observation?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. I do not find in your report that you gave any advice to the Government of the United States in respect to the restoration of Liliuokalani to her former rule?

Mr. Blount. I did not give any advice. I was not called on to give any advice to anybody; I went down there to report facts; those were my instructions, and I reported as I believed them to be.

The Chairman. Does your report contain all the information you gave to the Government of the United States with regard to the forces there?

Mr. Blount. I think it does; it is the only way I carried it—on those papers.

The Chairman. And you had no motive in your report of interfering with or changing the Government that existed in Hawaii and restoring Liliuokalani?

Mr. Blount. It never entered my head to do anything about the restoration of the Queen until I returned to the United States, except, as I told you, I would see the matter discussed in an American paper.

The Chairman. But as a purpose on your part?

Mr. Blount. Oh, no. I was rigidly loyal to the idea that I was not there except to report information.

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The Chairman. How long after your arrival in Honolulu was it before you gave orders to Admiral Skerrett to remove troops from the islands and to haul down the American flag?

Mr. Blount. In two or three days. You will see a record of that. I met people day and night. They met me cordially, people of both factions there at the legation. The active leaders would resent the idea in the newspapers of there being any danger of disorder. They would say to me it would be folly for us to attempt anything to change the present condition of affairs until the question of annexation was disposed of; that if the United States wanted to annex the islands, they would annex them; what could they do? That seemed to be in their minds, and the thought that determined the peace of the islands up to the time I left, so far as I could see.

The Chairman. Up to the time you caused Admiral Skerrett to withdraw his force did you find the people in a quiet state?

Mr. Blount. It was as quiet a looking city as ever I saw.

The Chairman. You could then see no occasion for military demonstration on shore for the purpose of protecting the peace?

Mr. Blount. None in the world, as I said in my report. I went to President Dole and told him my impression about it, and my purpose to withdraw the troops, and asked if he could preserve order. He said he could presrve order. I was hastened for the reason which appears in the report. I had learned of a meeting of some eighty people who wanted to communicate to me certain political views, and it occurred to me the best thing to do was to have the troops removed. I intended to have them removed lest it would appear that they had brought about the removal of the troops.

The Chairman. The day that the troops were removed was there any civil commotion in Honolulu?

Mr. Blount. Not the slightest. I did not go down to the Government building at the removal. I did not know but possibly there might be some demonstration and my presence might occasion it. I asked Admiral Skerrett to see what demonstrations, if any, were made, and he has reported it. Capt. Hooper, of the Rush, took me over. He is quite an intelligent gentleman. He was on the shore, and I said I would be glad to have him go down there and see the impression it made on the people, what manifestations there were. His report is of record.

The Chairman. During the time that you were there, the flag was ordered down. Was there any civil commotion in Honolulu, or any part of it, of which you were informed?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. Would you describe the condition of the people as one of peacefulness and quiet?

Mr. Blount. Yes, as a general rule, I would say that was true.

The Chairman. Was there any riot or outbreak of any kind?

Mr. Blount. Not the slightest.

The Chairman. Were you informed of any combinations of a political sort during your stay, to reinstate Liliuokalani by a counter revolution?

Mr. Blount. No. I have stated the condition of the native mind as far as I was impressed by it, and that was that they could do nothing until the United States determined upon the question of annexation.

The Chairman. Were the people quiet in their avocations?

Mr. Blount. Yes. There was nothing to indicate that there ever had been any revolution.

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The Chairman. Any disturbance in commercial affairs?

Mr. Blount. None that I could see.

The Chairman. Any depression in financial matters?

Mr. Blount. Yes, there seemed to be; but not so much as in the United States or in other parts of the world.

The Chairman. Was that due to the political situation, or attributable to their commerce?

Mr. Blount. One would think it was because of the political condition of affairs, and another that it was the general depression throughout the world.

The Chairman. Did you form any opinion while you were there of the financial situation in Hawaii, as to whether it had inspired confidence in it among the people—confidence in their banking institutions?

Mr. Blount. I could not say that I have formed an opinion worth stating. I do not think there was any trouble about their banking institutions or money.

The Chairman. This revolution does not seem to have interfered with the credit of the banks?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. What is the circulating medium in Honolulu?

Mr. Blount. They have some silver that was issued during Kalakaua's reign, and gold, and our Treasury notes.

The Chairman. Our Treasury notes?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Gray. Our paper money?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Gray. Is it as common there as it is here?

Mr. Blount. Just the same.

Senator Butler. Do you mean our money, or issues of the Hawaiian Government?

Mr. Blount. Our money.

The Chairman. Have they any paper issues of their own?

Mr. Blount. None that I ever saw.

The Chairman. Neither of the banks or of the Government?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. Did there seem to be a proper supply for the needs of the people?

Mr. Blount. I never heard any complaint.

The Chairman. The price of sugar was depressed while you were there?

Mr. Blount. An advance—there was a depression and rise, which was very inspiriting to the people. You spoke about a currency. There was no complaint. You will see that there had been in the Legislature some fellow who introduced a bill and got up an excitement on loaning money on real estate, just as you have seen here. But it did not take any form that indicated any stringency.

The Chairman. When you arrived in Hawaii, did you communicate your instructions to Mr. Stevens?

Mr. Blount. I did not.

The Chairman. Did you at any time before you left there?

Mr. Blount. I published the instructions.

The Chairman. Mr. Stevens did not have any official notice of them until they were published ?

Mr. Blount. No.

The Chairman. Did you confer with him when you directed Admiral Skerrett to remove the troops and haul down the flag?

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Mr. Blount. I did not. I did not confer with anybody except Admiral Skerrett.

The Chairman. Your orders appear here. I believe they were issued by you directly as a commissioner of the United States?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. And in virtue of this letter of authority to which you have already alluded?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Is your letter of authority printed in the report?

The Chairman. Yes.

Mr. Blount. My impression is that an order was made by the Secretary of the Navy, I am pretty sure there was, directing Admiral Skerrett to obey my orders. I do not know that that is in the printed report.

Senator Gray. Mr. Stevens was notified?

Mr. Blount. No.

Senator Dolph. Do you understand that Mr. Stevens was notified of the purpose and objects of Mr. Blount's commission?

Senator Gray. I think so. Let us see.

The Chairman. I think so. Senator Sherman. Did you communicate to Mr. Stevens the nature of the authority under which you were acting?

Mr. Blount. Mr. Stevens was informed by the Government itself. He had a communication which I think you will find there. I had no communication with Mr. Stevens at all with reference to my authority; the Government had undertaken to do that. My instructions were secret and I never gave them to anybody.

Senator Gray. I find on page 3 of this publication, document No. 2, letter from Department of State dated "Washington, March 11, 1893," which says:

"Department of State,
"Washington, March 11, 1893.
"Sir: With a view to obtaining the fullest possible information in regard to the condition of affairs in the Hawaiian Islands the President has determined to send to Honolulu, as his Special Commissioner, the honorable James H. Blount, lately chairman of the Committee on Foreign Affairs.
"Mr. Blount bears credential letters in that capacity, addressed to the President of the executive and advisory councils of the Provisional Government, and you are requested to facilitate his presentation.
"In all matters pertaining to the existing or other Government of the islands the authority of Mr. Blount is paramount. As regards the conduct of the usual business of the legation, you are requested to continue until further notice in the performance of your official functions, so far as they may not be inconsistent with the special powers confided to Mr. Blount. You are also requested to aid him in the fulfillment of his important mission by furnishing any desired assistance and information, and the archives of the legation should be freely accessible to him.
"Mr. Blount is fully instructed touching his relations to the commanding officer of the United States naval force in Hawaiian waters.
"I am, etc.,
"W. Q. Gresham."

That is signed by Mr. Gresham.

Mr. Blount. I understood that the Government communicated to Mr. Stevens what it wanted him to know.

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Senator Sherman. They gave him direct instructions?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. That was the only occasion of the communication of your authority to Mr. Stevens ?

Mr. Blount. I did not make them; I had a copy.

The Chairman. That is all the information Mr. Stevens had of your authority?

Mr. Blount. So far as I have any information. I suppose the Government has given you copies of everything—all their communications to and from Mr. Stevens.

The Chairman. The orders that you gave to Admiral Skerrett are supported, if I understand you correctly, alone by the letter of authority given to you by the Secretary of State?

Mr. Blount. And the letter that Mr. Herbert, the Secretary of the Navy, sent to Admiral Skerrett.

The Chairman. To execute your orders? Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. You construed your authority, of which you have just been speaking, to be sufficient to justify you in taking command of that fleet?

Senator Butler. Control.

The Chairman. I put it "command," for the purpose of removing the troops off the shore, and of hauling down the flag that had been raised there upon the Hawaiian public buildings?

Mr. Blount. I thought I was justified under the instruction and that order given by the Secretary of the Navy, of which I had information.

The Chairman. If at any time while you remained there you had supposed that the preservation of life and property and their treaty rights made it necessary, you thought you would have had authority, under the construction of your powers, to have ordered the troops back upon the shore?

Mr. Blount. I think so. The letter of the Secretary of State speaks of it. I do not recollect the exact instructions; but it speaks about my conferring with Admiral Skerrett—makes some such suggestions. But taking that communication and the order from the Secretary of the Navy to Admiral Skerrett, I thought I had authority to order the troops back to protect the property of American citizens.

The Chairman. You thought you were the judge of the political or actual situation in Hawaii, or in Honolulu, to the extent of authorizing you to protect the public peace, and thereby to protect American property and life?

Mr. Blount. I do not say to protect the public peace. I did not understand it to that extent. I understood that if there was a contest between the people of the Provisional Government and any other people there for the control of public affairs, if it did not involve the property and the persons of American citizens who were not participating in the conflict, I had nothing to do with it.

The Chairman. Would not a conflict of that kind in the city of Honolulu, with 20,000 population and a great many nationalities represented, necessarily involve some danger to American life and property and commerce?

Mr. Blount. I felt this way about that: I knew that that question was one that might come, and that I would wait until it came to see what discretion I would use under the circumstances that arose. I tried to carry out my power as I understood it.

The Chairman. And you construed your authority to be sufficient

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to enable you to use the naval forces of the United States then in the harbor for the purpose of protecting the life, liberty, and property and treaty rights of American citizens in the event of a commotion?

Mr. Blount. Yes. I think there is no doubt about that. I think that appears from my instructions. I think that is very clear.

Senator Butler. I understand that under your instructions if that exigency had arisen, and you thought it necessary, you would have ordered the troops ashore to protect life and property?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. In ordering these troops from the shore to the ship, were you influenced by this construction of your authority?

Mr. Blount. There were several things. It did not seem to me that an investigation could go on very well with the flag and troops there. They were calculated to repress certain people and prevent them testifying— if that condition of things were kept up. In the next place, it did not occur to me that there was any justification for it at all, for its continuance. I have nothing to say about the original placing of it; it was not a matter of my own to determine. But I found it there; I thought it could be removed without any difficulty, and I accordingly ordered the flag removed and the troops back on board the vessel. Before proceeding further, here are what I conceive to be the orders under which Admiral Skerrett was acting:

"March 11, 1893.
"Sir: This letter will be handed to you by the Hon. James H. Blount, Special Commissioner from the President of the United States to the Government of the Hawaiian Islands.
"You will consult freely with Mr. Blount, and will obey any instructions you may receive from him regarding the course to be pursued at said islands by the force under your command.
"You will also afford Mr. Blount all such facilities as he may desire for the use of your cipher code in communicating by telegraph with this Government.
"Respectfully,
"Hilary A. Herbert,
"Secretary of the Navy.
"Rear-Admiral J. S. Skerrett,
"Commander in Chief United States Naval Forces,
"Pacific Station, Flagship Mohican, Honolulu, H.I. "

The Chairman. That was the order of the Secretary of the Navy to which you had reference?

Mr. Blount. Yes. Mr. Chairman, allow me a moment. I made a statement a while ago that until my instructions were published I had not communicated then to anybody. I forgot that I did communicate then to Admiral Skerrett. I felt that I could not confer with him about anything unless he knew my instructions.

The Chairman. Knew what your instructions were?

Mr. Blount.Yes.

The Chairman. The extent of your authority?

Mr. Blount.Yes. No officer connected with the vessels there other than Admiral Skerrett had any knowledge of it.

The Chairman. I will ask you the question: Was the movement of the troops or the orders for hauling down the flag in any respect intended to be an evidence of your participation in the domestic affairs

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of Hawaii, so as to favor either the Queen's form of government or the then existing Government—the Dole regime?

Mr. Blount. My idea about it was, the effect would be to impress both sides with the belief that I was not going to participate in their local affairs.

The Chairman. Was that your intention?

Mr. Blount. Such was my intention. I did not think the flag troops ought to be there. It did not occur to me just; it did not occur to me that investigation could go on with them there.

Senator Gray. I understand the chairman's question to be, did you intend the removal of those troops to give intimation to either side of your intention toward them?

Mr. Blount. I did not. I thought that it would be an intimation to both sides that I did not come down there to do anything with their controversies.

The Chairman. Your position was one of strict neutrality between them?

Mr. Blount. As much so as I could possibly make it. I never went into the house of a royalist but once while I was in Honolulu. I called on Mr. J. O. A. Carter with my family, with Mrs. Blount, just before leaving.

Senator Sherman. He was the former minister?

Mr. Blount. He was a brother of the former minister.

Senator Gray. I think the former minister is dead.

Mr. Blount. He is. He is the brother of the former minister, on whom I called. I called on President Dole, the attorney-general, the minister of the interior, the vice-president—the persons connected with the Government. I felt that I could do that without subjecting myself to general intercourse with the people. They were officials of the Government, and I announced to both sides that I felt bound to do that.

The Chairman. With the exception of the Queen and cabinet and the commander of the military forces, and of the civil forces, called the police, was there any substantial change in the personnel of the Government from what it was formerly, when you got to Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. As to the personnel?

The Chairman. Yes.

Mr. Blount. Well, the---

Senator Butler. As I understand, you arrived there after the Provisional Government was established?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Butler. You have no information as to the personnel of the Queen's government?

The Chairman. My question relates to what Mr. Blount learned as to what was the composition of the former government, as to its personnel.

Mr. Blount. I think the police force as a rule was left untouched. I never went into it particularly.

The Chairman. The army was disbanded—the Queen's army, body guard.

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

The Chairman. Do you remember whether any body guard was reserved to her for her protection ?

Mr. Blount. It was not so when I was there.

The Chairman. In other respects the Government went on under existing laws, saving, of course, the revolution which had taken place in the head of the Government?

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Mr. B ount. The information on that point appears in the correspondence between the Provisional Government and the Government here, and I would take it as the highest evidence.

The Chairman. That conforms to your own observations?

Mr. Blount. Yes, as to the character of the Government set up.

The Chairman. I suppose you ascertained that during the decade previously to this revolution there had been a great many changes in the political attitude of a great many leading men in Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

The Chairman. Politics had been a pretty lively subject in Hawaii some years before you got there?

Mr. Blount. Everything is little down there. It was lively for them in noise.

Senator Butler. It would not be considered very lively in Georgia, New York, or Ohio, I suspect?

Mr. Blount. Oh, no.

The Chairman. Would you say that the people there are given to participating in political agitations?

Mr. Blount. I would say more so than in Alabama. They get them pretty well worked up.

The Chairman. Meeting in conventions, public meetings, and having their say?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes. I want to say that so far as that matter is concerned I took no testimony.

The Chairman. I am getting your impressions aside from the testimony you took.

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. You would say, I suppose, that there was a pretty large feeling on the part of the press in Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes. You would take up the papers there and read one side and the other where they would make the most villifying personal attacks that you could conceive of. I would learn when these gentlemen would meet that it was just a good joke. I spoke once to Mr. Dole about it; I said, "I do not see how you can keep the peace with the people attacking each other this way."

He said, "That does not amount to anything; they are friendly when they meet. My attention was directed to that because I was apprehensive from seeing these articles that some disturbance would come, and I always talked very freely to the Government about the public peace. I was doing no harm on that ground; they seemed to want to talk with me; they came to me when there was fear of disturbance, and I would not communicate it to the other side. Then the other side would come, and I did not mention what they said to the Government. In this way I got information of both sides. I saw that there would be no trouble.

The Chairman. We have gone through a general view of this matter; I will turn Mr. Blount over to any one who wishes to ask any questions.

Senator Dolph. I wish to ask a few questions.

Senator Gray. No questions occur to me now.

Senator Dolph. You say that Secretary Foster showed you a letter from Minister Stevens, written in November, 1892?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Concerning affairs in the islands?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. That letter contains a pretty full account of the political situation there?

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Mr. Blount. That is amongst your papers.

Senator Dolph. I saw the letter at the time. I suppose it was shown to you in confidence because you were on the Committee on Foreign Relations of the House.

Mr. Blount. Very largely so.

Senator Dolph. Did you form any opinion at that time about Hawaiian affairs and as to the fitness of Mr. Stevens for the position he occupied?

Mr. Blount. I did not. I did not like the looks of the letter; but I think they did not make much impression on me. I went off home; I did not think much about it.

The Chairman. You had then declared your determination of retiring from Congress?

Mr. Blount. I did not intend to hold any place when I went away from here. I did not even pay my respects to the President.

The Chairman. You had determined to retire from public life?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

Senator Dolph. You did not consider there was any impropriety in such a letter coming from a minister of the United States?

Mr. Blount. No. Perhaps I misunderstood what you said.

Senator Gray. Mr. Blount did not speak about the impropriety; he spoke of the impression.

Mr. Blount. Oh, I rather had an impression—it was a vague one— that it manifested some passing beyond the proprieties for an American representative in a foreign country.

Senator Dolph. That was not long before the news arrived in the United States in reference to the revolution in Hawaii, was it?

Mr. Blount. My impression is that the treaty had been negotiated at the time. The Secretary of State sent for me and expressed a desire that I would endeavor to bring the Democratic party to the point of supporting the ratification of the treaty and acceptance of annexation.

Senator Dolph. Then you saw that letter after the news of the revolution had arrived here?

Mr. Blount. That is my impression. I think I am correct.

Senator Dolph. Did you express any opinion concerning the revolution, or the part which it was alleged had been taken by Minister Stevens in connection with the same, shortly after the news arrived and while Congress was still in session?

Mr. Blount. My impression is that I avoided the subject. I recollect saying once to a newspaper correspondent when the announcement was made of the establishing of an American protectorate by the American minister that "it looked a little lively." I did not think much about it at the time; I did not care much about it; I was going away.

Senator Dolph. Have you stated what the expression was you used?

Mr. Blount. I said, " It looked a little lively." That I believe to be it.

Senator Dolph. Did you express any opinion concerning the landing of the naval forces upon the island?

Mr. Blount. No. I say that because my recollection of it is that I did not know anything about the particulars at all.

Senator Dolph. Did you form any opinion shortly after the receipt of the news of the revolution, or after the treaty had been negotiated and sent to Congress, concerning the question of annexation?

Mr. Blount. I did not form any opinion.

Senator Dolph. Or express any?

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Mr. Blount. I had some apprehension that there might have been something imprudent done there; I had no opinion.

Senator Dolph. Did you not have conversations with various persons about the affair?

Mr. Blount. Very little. I was authorized to show that paper. It was given to me in manuscript—the letter of November. I was authorized to show it to some persons, in my discretion.

Senator Dolph. The letter of Minister Stevens to the Secretary of State?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. And you were furnished a copy?

Mr. Blount. Certainly, with a view of conferring with certain persons.

Senator Dolph. Did you show it to members of the House?

Mr. Blount. I showed it to Governor MeCreary and, possibly, Mr. Hitt, and possibly some others. I do not know now.

Senator Dolph. Did you have any conversations with those people about the subject of the annexation of Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. I can not remember that I did, other than showing that paper.

Senator Dolph. Did you undertake to secure the approval of your colleagues on that committee or in the House of annexation?

Mr. Blount. No.

Senator Dolph. Did you express any opinion in favor of annexation?

Mr. Blount. I think not.

Senator Dolph. Or against it?

Mr. Blount. I think not.

Senator Dolph. You think you simply handed that persons named, and possibly others, without any conversation or suggestions with regard to that?

Mr. Blount. Oh, I have not said that.

Senator Dolph. That is what I am trying to get at.

The Chairman. Allow me to ask if that is the letter to which you refer, and of which Mr. Foster gave you a copy (referring to Executive Document of the House of Representatives No. 74, page 111 of the Report.)

Mr. Blount. I think it is.

Senator Dolph. What did you say to Mr. Foster you would do concerning his request?

Mr. Blount. I did not say to Mr. Foster that I would do anything. He showed me that letter and expressed a desire that I would endeavor to bring the Democratic party to the support of the annexation of the Hawaiian Islands.

Senator Dolph. Mr. Foster gave you a copy of that letter and made that request, and you made no response to it?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes, I did.

Senator Dolph. I would like to know what you said to him.

Mr. Blount. I said to him, "I do not know anything about it." The paper was handed to me. He did not expect any answer. The whole thing was new to me.

Senator Dolph. You did not read it in Mr. Foster's presence?

Mr. Blount. No. He handed it to me to be read, and I said, "You have given me this paper; I can not converse with the Democrats without this paper." I had not seen the paper. Mr. Foster said, "I will leave that to your discretion."

Senator Dolph. I am asking if you expressed any opinion in the

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matter, because in the press it has been charged that you expressed an opinion.

Mr. Blount. Yes, I understand you.

Senator Dolph. You think you did not express an opinion?

Mr. Blount. I think not, because I did not have any.

Senator Dolph. You were here during the inauguration of President Cleveland?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Did you call on the President before you left the city?

Mr. Blount. I did not.

Senator Dolph. Or Secretary Gresham?

Mr. Blount. No; I did not see Secretary Gresham. I knew him when be was Postmaster-General.

Senator Dolph. What time did you leave Washington?

Mr. Blount. I do not recollect; I stayed here three or four days.

Senator Dolph. After the inauguration?

Mr. Blount. Yes; there was a crowd, a jam, and I did not care to start home because of the liability to accidents, etc.

Senator Dolph. Can you recall any conversation with either of the gentlemen to whom you handed a copy of that letter?

Mr. Blount. I can not. I handed it to them; and I may possibly have said to them, "I am not satisfied to make any effort on this paper; I do not think there is information enough."

Senator Dolph. How many times did you see Mr. Gresham, the Secretary of State, before you left for Honolulu—when you came here in response to the telegraphic request of Mr. Smith?

Mr. Blount. I arrived here on Sunday morning, I think. I went with the Secretary of the Interior to the State Department. I met, casually, the Secretary of the Navy in the office of the Secretary of State. That is the first time I met the Secretary of State.

Senator Gray. The first time?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Gray. The first time you met Mr. Gresham since you knew him as Postmaster-General?

Mr. Blount. Yes. And the next time I met him was the next day. I went over to his office, and he took me into a little room—you recollect where the foreign ministers are received?

Senator Butler. For consultation ?

Mr. Blount. Yes. He had the clerk read the instructions over, with the view, rather, of putting them in a more tasteful form—criticising the instructions. That was the second time. And I possibly met him a third time.

Senator Dolph. How many conversations did you have with Secretary Gresham that second time?

Mr. Blount. I can not really tell you.

Senator Dolph. Was that the time that he told you that he knew of no principle of international law which justified the raising of the United States flag in Honolulu?

Mr. Blount. I can not say exactly what time it was.

Senator Dolph. You are not certain?

Mr. Blount. No. It may have been then or at a later conversation.

Senator Dolph. Did he not couple with his remark about the raising of a United States flag one about the landing of the United States marines and the assumption of a protectorate over the islands ?

Mr. Blount. Perhaps so.

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Senator Dolph. Is that all he said? Please give that conversation as nearly as you can recall it.

Mr. Blount. That would be a very difficult thing to do. At the time I just recollect the general impression that I had that he did not think the flag ought to be there or the troops on shore.

Senator Dolph. He did not think the flag ought to be there and the troops on shore?

Mr. Blount. That was his expression. But the instructions---

Senator Dolph. Did you understand that, while he left it to your discretion, unless the facts showed that it should not be done, the flag should be haulded down and the troops ordered off the island?

Mr. Blount. My impression is that he thought that ought to be done. But the islands were a long way off, and it was a matter in which I was to be guided very largely by circumstances. There was to be carefulness lest there should be bloodshed growing out of it— disorder. He could not tell.

Senator Dolph. Was anything said about the annexation of the islands at that time in your conversation, or at any other time?

Mr. Blount. Not that I recollect.

Senator Dolph. What was said, if anything, as to the time when these troops should be landed—as to whether there was any exigency for that, calling for the landing of the troops?

Mr. Blount. Nothing that I can recall.

Senator Dolph. Could you give the substance of that conversation?

Mr. Blount. I think I have given you the substance.

Senator Dolph. How long was the conversation?

Mr. Blount. That I do not remember. It has been some months ago.

Senator Dolph. Were you there an hour or minute?

Mr. Blount. Well, I might have been about the office—not with the Secretary—a half hour.

Senator Dolph. How long were you with the Secretary?

Mr. Blount. During the reading of that paper and criticizing the language. The time was occupied in that way. There was very little said.

Senator Dolph. If you saw the Secretary again before you left for Honolulu, state where and when it was.

Mr. Blount. My recollection is that I went over to the office, and by arrangement went back there and got the instructions, as they had been finally prepared and agreed on, and I went with the Secretary over to the White House, the expectation being that I would go in and talk with the President and Cabinet. I mean to say that was his idea. When I got over there I was not invited in until they had concluded their deliberations. I was introduced. Of course I knew the President and some members of the Cabinet. I was introduced to some others. The subject of the islands was not mentioned at all. I only staid a minute or two; in fact, I could not see why I was taken in there; nobody said anything to introduce a topic of conversation. I went to the President and said, "Mr. President, I shall try not to make any mistake under my instructions down there." He said, "I do not think you will." As I passed the table going out, the President said, in a careless way, "Blount, you will let us hear from you." I said I would, when there is anything worth writing about, and that is all that occurred. I called to pay my respects on Sunday morning.

Senator Dolph. I thought that was to the Secretary.

Mr. Blount. No.

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Senator Dolph. Did you have any talk with the President when you called Sunday morning to pay your respects?

Mr. Blount. The Secretary of the Interior and I were in there to pay my respects. It was Sunday morning, and we did not stay long.

Senator Dolph. Did the Secretary of State or his private secretary read over the instructions'?

Mr. Blount. The private secretary, I think, read them.

Senator Dolph. Did the private secretary retire during your conversation with Mr. Gresham?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes; he was not present at the conversation.

Senator Dolph. No one was present at your conversation with the Secretary of State about your duties in Hawaii ?

Mr. Blount. No.

Senator Dolph. You can not tell whether you were with him a half hour?

Mr. Blount. I do not recollect. The paper was read. That was the main thing—reading over that paper and looking at it. Very little was said.

The Chairman. I would like to ask a question on a matter some of you gentlemen may wish to interrogate Mr. Blount about. I find in a paper that has been printed by the House, Executive Document 13, which seems to be some additional correspondence not published before that time, at least in compliance with any request of the House or Senate, a telegram of Mr. Foster to Mr. Stevens. It is on page 31 of this document which I hold in my hand.

"Department of State,
"Washington, February 14, 1893.
"Your telegram of the 1st instant has been received, with coincident report from commander of the Boston. Press telegrams from San Francisco give full details of events of 1st instant, with text of your proclamation. The latter, in announcing assumption of protection of the Hawaiian Islands in the name of the United States, would seem to be tantamount to the assumption of a protectorate over those islands on behalf of the United States, with all the rights and obligations which the term implies. It is not thought, however, that the request of the Provisional Government for protection, or your action in compliance therewith, contemplated more than the cooperation of the moral and material forces of the United States to strengthen the authority of the Provisional Government, by according to it adequate protection for life and property during the negotiations instituted here, and without interfering with the execution of public affairs. Such cooperation was and is within your standing instructions and those of the naval commanders in Hawaiian waters.
"So far as your course accords to the de facto sovereign Government the material cooperation of the United States for the maintenance of good order and protection of life and property from apprehended disorders, it is commended; but so far as it may appear to overstep that limit by setting the authority of the United States above that of the Hawaiian Government in the capacity of protector, or to impair the independent sovereignty of that Government by substituting the flag and power of the United States, it is disavowed.
"Instructions will be sent to naval commanders, confirming and renewing those heretofore given them, under which they are authorized and directed to cooperate with yon in case of need. Your own instructions
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are likewise renewed and you are accordingly authorized to arrange with the commanding officer for the continued presence on shore of such marine force as may be practicable and requisite for the security of the lives and property interests of American citizens and the repression of lawlessness threatening them whenever in your judgment it shall be necessary so to do, or when such cooperation may be sought for good cause by the Government of the Hawaiian Islands, being, however, always careful to distinguish between these functions of voluntary or accorded protection and the assumption of a protectorate over the Government of the Hawaiian Islands, which the United States have recognized as sovereign and with which they treat on terms of sovereign equality.
"John W. Foster"

Senator Gray. That has been printed before.

The Chairman. That is addressed to Minister Stevens. I wish to inquire whether you had knowledge of the existence of this telegraphic dispatch before you went away?

Mr. Blount. I was going to say in response to the Senator that I expressed to the President the desire not to go off until I knew what was in the State Department in the way of information, and the Secretary of State had collected all the documents; they had all been sent to the Senate, and they were given to me in confidence. I took them and read them on the way from San Francisco to Honolulu, as much as I could with seasickness. I never looked at them in Washington.

The Chairman. The documents?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. Was the one I have just read amongst them?

Mr. Blount. Yes, given to me confidentially.

Senator Dolph. When you left for Hawaii you took your instructions?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Which you considered private?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. And the communication to Admiral Skerrett which has been read ?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. And an official communication to the Provisional Government?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. And a letter to Minister Stevens?

Mr. Blount. Yes—no, I did not deliver the letter; the letter was sent to Minister Stevens.

Senator Dolph. You did not yourself carry him any communication?

Mr. Blount. No; I had a copy. Now, I believe I did hand that paper to Mr. Stevens on shipboard. I could not say positively about that.

Senator Dolph. It is immaterial.

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Now, under your instructions and the letter of the Secretary of the Navy to Admiral Skerrett, you were placed in supreme command of the naval forces in Hawaii, so far as any relation of our Government to the islands was concerned, were you not?

Mr. Blount. Well, that language might import more than I would be willing to admit. Without defining in general terms 1 felt from the instructions of the Secretary of the Navy to Admiral Skerrett that

S. Doc. 231, pt 6----19

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I had the right to direct the removal of the flag and the return of the marines to the vessel, and that I had authority to protect American citizens in their persons and in their property and to see to the proper observance of treaties. 1 did not understand that I had any power beyond that.

Senator Dolph. You did not understand that it was your duty to wait until the actual destruction of the property of American citizens commenced, until their lives were in actual jeopardy, before you took steps to land the United States marines to prevent such injury to the lives and property of American citizens, did you? That was a matter resting in your discretion at the time, was it not?

Mr. Blount. That was not mentioned. My idea was that I could not anticipate. I thought it over. I could not anticipate the circumstances which might arise; but when they did I was to exercise the best judgment I had in connection with Admiral Skerrett.

Senator Dolph. You understood it rested in your judgment?

Mr. Blount. I understood that it rested in my judgment—the protection of American citizens in their lives and property in any disturbance on the islands. Any particular circumstances did not occur to my mind.

Senator Gray. You felt that it was in your judgment to act when the particular circumstances arose, when the exigency called for it?

Mr. Blount. That is it.

The Chairman. In my mind the evidence would seem to indicate that it was left to Mr. Blount to determine what was the political situation in Hawaii, and in consultation with Admiral Skerrett he was to determine what should be done in a military way—what should be done by the United States on that occasion ?

Senator Gray. Is that true?

Mr. Blount. 1 think that is true. I think, perhaps, it ought to be added, and my impression was, that if I had issued an order—and I took that not from the instructions but from the letter of the Secretary of the Navy—if I issued an order, the admiral would obey.

Senator Dolph. The Admiral was not to exercise his discretion as to whether it was proper or not?

Mr. Blount. I understood that I was to confer. That is clear in that paper. I was to confer with Admiral Skerrett, and I took it for granted that there would not be any difficulty about our differing on the question of landing troops.

Senator Dolph. Was there any chance of a difference?

Mr. Blount. Oh, there was a possible chance. But my idea was that in handling the troops on shore it would be a thing that ought to be very largely governed by Admiral Skerrett.

Senator Dolph. That Admiral Skerrett was to obey your orders?

Mr. Blount. You have the paper.

Senator Dolph. How long was it from the time you arrived in Hawaii until you published your instructions ?

Mr. Blount. That is a matter of record, and not in my mind. I want to say this: I have not seen these papers in six months; my mind has been diverted, and I can not recollect. I could tell you absolutely in a few minutes by looking at these documents.

Senator Dolph. Up until that time no one in the islands but Admiral Skerrett knew what your instructions were or what was the object of your mission in the islands?

Mr. Blount. They never knew definitely. Of course, I was conducting an examination; sometimes it would be a member of the Provisional

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Government and sometimes a royalist. I had no right to compel secrecy. There is a letter there from a man by the name of Ashford. He came in early, and I thought he was a pretty intelligent man. I did not know what sort of character he was. I thought I would learn something. He was disposed to talk. I said, "Will you not write me out your views;" and he did so. Sometime afterward, Mr. Smith, one of the editors of the annexation organ, the Hawaiian Star, said, "I got hold of something going on here; some of these fellows who come before you and are examined, tell." I said, "I did not tell you anything," and after that I found Ashford's letter published in the California papers. I did not see anything wrong, so far as the character of my investigation was concerned. I communicated nothing at all; but, of course, these people talked among themselves.

Senator Butler. I understand you to say that, so far as you were concerned, you made no communication of your instructions to anybody?

Mr. Blount. No; I did not.

Senator Dolph. Where were your headquarters; where was your investigation conducted?

Mr. Blount. It was conducted in a cottage on the grounds of the Hawaiian hotel, possibly some 50 yards from the main building, where I took my meals.

Senator Dolph. Were your family and suite the only occupants of the place?

Mr. Blount. When we got there some tourists occupied a part of it. It was not private enough, and I said unless I got the cottage to myself I would leave. It was accordingly arranged.

Senator Gray. The cottage belonged to the hotel?

Mr. Blount. Yes. I went to the hotel and got my meals; but I did not want to be where anybody was.

Senator Dolph. Were your examinations held at regular hours on appointed days, and adjourned from day to day, or were they just as you could get witnesses ?

Mr. Blount. I could always get a witness. The telephone system there is the finest you ever saw. I could get anybody I wanted. The rule I adopted was this: I would send for a witness on either side. I would telephone for him or use any other means I saw fit that was most convenient. I would examine the witness in the presence of my stenographer. Sometimes it would run over to the second day. I recollect once especially, in the case of Mr. Damon, whose examination was continued at his suggestion. When asked as to whether or not the recognition by Mr. Stevens took place before he went over to the palace, he said that he thought it did; but he wanted to talk about it to the attorney-general, Mr. Smith. He went off, and came back in a day or two and the examination was continued.

Senator Dolph. You misunderstood my question. I want to know whether you treated your proceedings in the nature of a court, and held regular sessions at an appointed hour, with adjournments from day to day?

Mr. Blount. Do you mean whether it was public?

Senator Dolph. No, not whether it was public, but whether you adjourned at regular hours, or conducted it to suit your convenience?

Mr. Blount. At my convenience. I had nothing to do with social life.

Senator Dolph. Who was present at any time?

Mr. Blount. Nobody present except my stenographer, the witness,

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and myself; and no man ever knew from me what anybody had testified to.

Senator Dolph. I suppose you talked with a great many persons about this subject?

Mr. Blount. Oh, they talked to me; but I never communicated my views.

Senator Dolph. You were told a great many things on both sides of this question by persons who had called upon you?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. And you never felt it incumbent upon you to make any record of what was said to you, or any report of it, except it was something which, in your judgment, ought to be taken down and reported? That is, you exercised your own judgment as to whether anything said to you should be made a part of your report; did you not?

Mr. Blount. If I were to answer that directly, without any qualification, perhaps I would not convey a correct impression. I saw people and they would talk to me. For instance, a man would come in and say he was a royalist, and he would commence to abuse Mr. Stevens. I would say nothing at all. I could not communicate to him, and did not encourage the conversation. And so somebody else on the other side would abuse the royalists. I could not help those things. Those were the things that occurred. I never indulged in conversation with people about affairs there, as a rule.

The Chairman. At what time did you send your report to the Secretary of State as to the condition of affairs in Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. The final report, I think, was in the month of July. But the record discloses that. I can not remember it.

The Chairman. Was it after you were appointed minister?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. It appears that you were appointed minister on the 22d of August; that is, a letter informing you of your appointment on that date, with various items of inclosure and instruction, was sent to you as minister of the United States. On that appointment you took the oath of office?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

The Chairman. Did you then communicate your appointment to the Dole Government?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

The Chairman. Did you make any communication of that to the Liliuokalani cabinet?

Mr. Blount. Not the slightest. I had nothing to do with Liliuokalani at all; it was not a proper thing, I did not think.

The Chairman. And you continued in that office until you were asked to resign and came home ?

Mr. Blount. I sent my resignation by the vessel that brought the appointment. I expected to leave when I got through the investigation. My private business was not satisfactory, and I wanted to get home. I was worried about it. I thought it might be childish in me to send an absolute resignation, and I did not put it in that form; but I did take occasion in some correspondence to assure the Secretary that I did not want the place at all. As I said, my private business required that I should be at home.

The Chairman. The question is whether, while you were minister, the instructions of the Government to you in regard to Hawaiian affairs had been in any wise altered ?

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Mr. Blount. No.

Senator Dolph. I do not think you understood my question a few minutes ago, that you did not consider it incumbent upon you to make any record of these statements made by the numerous persons who called upon you and talked about the situation in Hawaii or include them in your report.

Mr. Blount. No. If you will allow me to state, you will very readily see that I could not trust memory about those things, and hence I resorted to the plan of taking the statements in the form of interrogation and answer by the stenographer. I thought I would be enabled after the examination of witnesses on both sides, leading persons, to get at the condition of affairs; and, therefore, I did not trouble myself with every person whom I would meet who wanted to talk with me.

Senator Dolph. You exercised your own judgment and choice as to which of the persons you came in contact with you would examine?

Mr. Blount. I felt that I was there to conduct the examination, and I determined that I would conduct it according to my best judgment for the purpose of eliciting the truth. On one occasion, for instance, there was a committee came to me from the Annexation Club and said they had been appointed for the purpose of furnishing witnesses to me for the purpose of being examined. I was not pleased with it. That club was made up of people of all nationalities. I said to them, "Gentlemen, you do not understand my relation to you, or I do not. I am not a representative of any body in Honolulu; I am not under the control of any body in Honolulu; I am here to make an investigation for the Government of the United States, and while, perhaps, I will examine some persons you want examined, as a rule I want to direct these examinations and say whom I will examine and whom not."

Senator Dolph. You indicated plainly to them that you would not hear any witnesses?

Mr. Blount. I did not intimate anything of the kind.

Senator Dolph. What did you say in regard to the proposition of this committee to furnish witnesses on the question?

Mr. Blount. I said to them I would perhaps examine some of their witnesses; but I did not consent to the idea that the Annexation Club or anybody else was to furnish witnesses to me.

Senator Dolph. Did you examine any witnesses furnished by that committee?

Mr. Blount. Oh, I examined—the only name they ever mentioned to me was Mr. P. C. Jones.

Senator Gray. Tell about P. C. Jones's examination. Did you examine him?

Mr. Blount. No; I did not—regretted that I could not. There were other persons whom I would like to have examined. There was quite a mania on the part of the people on both sides to be examined when they saw the testimony was going into a public document. I would have gratified many of them if there had been an unlimited clerical force at my command; but I did not have it, and I did not believe it was going to elucidate anything to multiply witnesses.

Senator Gray. Did Mr. Jones proffer himself as a witness?

Mr. Blount. Oh, no. A young man came in there by the name of Wilder, a boyish sort of fellow, with this statement.

Senator Gray. About Mr. Jones?

Mr. Blount. About the wishes of the Annexation Club—a person whom I did not consider proper to take counsel with. I do not mean

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that he was not a gentleman, but I had an idea about the Annexation Club, that there was a pretty rough element in there, and I know that was the opinion of the Provisional Government—many of them indulging in threats of assassination. They wanted me to turn over the celebration of the Fourth of July to the club, a political organization, which I declined; whereupon it went out in the United States that I was not in favor of the celebration of the Fourth, refused to arrange for the celebration of the Fourth, and all that sort of thing, although I presided at the celebration. I did not go to their meeting one night, Mr. Severance agreeing to go in my place to make arrangements for the appointment of committees, etc.

The Chairman. Did you preside at the Fourth of July meeting?

Mr. Blount. Yes. "Marching Through Georgia" was played and all sorts of things.

Senator Dolph. Was Mr. Nordhoff there, the correspondent of the Herald?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Did you meet him frequently?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Talked to him freely about the condition of affairs?

Mr. Blount. I did not.

Senator Dolph. Did you see a comparison in the New York Sun of portions of your report with letters of Nordhoff to his paper?

Mr. Blount. I did not. If you will allow me, I never took up the subject of writing that report, never wrote a line until Mr. Nordhoff left the islands ?

Senator Dolph. You have not seen the Sun article?

Mr. Blount. No; I have not.

Senator Dolph. I understood you to say that none of the witnesses who appeared before you were sworn?

Mr. Blount. Oh, no; I did not feel that I had authority to swear witnesses. I had them sign their testimony after reading it over.

The Chairman. There were affidavits submitted to you?

Mr. Blount. There were some four or five affidavits—the matter in them very short. I did not have the time, and I said to those gentlemen, "I would be very glad if you would put these facts in the form of an affidavit, and they were brought there that way. It came about simply because of the pressure of time. I did not care to go into a general examination of those people; I did not have the means to do it.

Senator Dolph. Did you in all cases have the statements of the parties who appeared before you extended into longhand and approved?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. Was all that was said before you by Admiral Skerrett made a part of your report?

Mr. Blount. All that was said on what subject?

Senator Dolph. On any subject. Did you report the communication from Admiral Skerrett—make it a part of your report?

Mr. Blount. Yes, I did. For instance, I said to Admiral Skerrett, "Let us take a walk and see where those troops were located;" and we went. I wanted him to see, and I pointed out, where Arion Hall was, and the Government building from which the proclamation was read. I said, "What do you think about locating troops here so near the building under the circumstances?" He said, "They were not located here." He was under the impression that they were located some distance off. I said, "You are mistaken about that; I know they were located here." I said to him, "Now what do you think of this position of

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the troops?" Of course, this was on the street, and it was not taken down. I suppose you wanted to know that.

Senator Dolph. It is interesting, and I would like to hear it.

Mr. Blount. Then Admiral Skerrett expressed the opinion which is contained in his statement. I said to him, "Admiral, I would be glad if you would give me that in writing;" and he gave it to me, and I forwarded it.

Senator Gray. That is the statement that appears in print?

Mr. Blount. That is the statement that appears in print.

Senator Dolph. The whole statement appears in print?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. It was a conversation with you?

Mr. Blount. Yes. My relations were closer with Admiral Skerrett than anybody else, consulting with him and so on. You can understand that it is an unsatisfactory state to be in, to be 2,000 miles from your country and nobody to talk to but Admiral Skerrett and my stenographer. They were the only persons I could talk to.

Senator Dolph. Were any communications furnished to you upon the subject of your investigation which were not made a part of your report?

Mr. Blount. I do not understand what you mean.

Senator Dolph. Was everything included in your report which was furnished to you on the subject—written communication?

Mr. Blount. I do not think I left any out.

Senator Dolph. You have spoken in your examination of having said to the Provisional Government that you would be glad to receive a statement from those in power, and you spoke as though that had been addressed not only to the President but to the others.

Mr. Blount. I used to go to the Government building where the president and his cabinet were sitting about, and I made the statement.

Senator Dolph. Did you make a public statement, an address?

Mr. Blount. Oh, no. They were sitting around a table. They made a small party, the president and cabinet and myself sitting in there— no formality.

Senator Dolph. Hou came you to be present at the cabinet meeting?

Mr. Blount. It was not a cabinet meeting; they sat in the same room and talked. I used to go in there and talk, and they came to the legation.

Senator Dolph. Do you recollect the conversation that day between you and the members of the Provisional Government?

Mr. Blount. It was not of any consequence; I remember that portion of it.

Senator Dolph. Did you address your conversation to any particular one, and if so what was said?

Mr. Blount. President Dole and the cabinet were sitting around, and I said to them, "Gentlemen, I would like to examine any of you with regard to the revolution; I can conceive that you might not care to submit to it." There was no response.

Senator Dolph. Was that before or after the publication of your instructions?

Mr. Blount. My impression is that it was before.

Senator Dolph. So they knew nothing about the object of your mission except what had leaked out from the examination of witnesses when you made that suggestion?

Mr. Blount. Leaked out? There was not much leaking about it.

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Vice-President Damon came a few days afterward and was examined. Earlier than this Mr. Bishop, connected with the press, was examined. There were several persons on the annexation side who were examined. I did not suppose that there was any withholding of it from the Government at all; I think they knew very well what I was doing.

The Chairman. Allow me to inquire whether Sereno Bishop is a relative of the wealthy man who has made so many endowments there?

Mr. Blount. I think not; I think Charles E. Bishop came from Boston— a young man.

The Chairman. And married a native?

Mr. Blount. A native princess. He is a very excellent gentleman. Sereno Bishop's father was a missionary. I think I have this from Mr. Bishop. He was born down at Lahaina, on the island of Maui, the old capital.

Senator Dolph. Who were the people representing the Queen's cause—her side of the controversy ?

Mr. Blount. Do you mean before me?

Senator Dolph. No; I do not mean to say there was any representation before you. I understand that was with closed doors; there was no one present but you and the stenographer. I mean persons who saw you in the islands.

The Chairman. The alleged leaders of the Queen's cause.

Senator Dolph. The alleged leaders of her government.

Mr. Blount. Do you mean leaders in the sense of counseling in this investigation?

Senator Dolph. That assumes that I am assuming that you allowed yourself to be counseled and directed by these people. I do not wish to convey any such impression. People called on you and talked with you, and I understood they called from early morning until late at night, and they talked about the matter of this revolution.

Mr. Blount. I think you are entirely courteous; but this matter goes down in print, and therefore, I ask that everything be made plain, and that my every answer may be correct. I am not in the condition that you gentlemen are. I understand that I am the subject of a great deal of criticism, which is legitimate, and I want to understand the questions I am answering.

The Chairman. You mean to say that the right to criticise you is a legitimate one?

Mr. Blount. Yes.

Senator Dolph. I do not mean to criticise you. I wish to know who were the people who appeared, who called to represent the Queen's interest. That is all.

The Chairman. Who were the reputed leaders of the royal party?

Senator Gray. Whom you met.

Mr. Blount. The matter of leadership there is a very uncertain thing. There are a good many factions amongst them, as you will see from the testimony. But I would say that amongst the more prominent persons in the islands you will find Mr. J. O. A. Carter, Mr. E. C. MacFarlane, Mr. Parker---

The Chairman. Sam Parker?

Mr. Blount. Sam Parker—a man by the name of Bush. He is another leader amongst them. They rather struck me with a little more positive force than some others.

Senator Dolph. At the time the revolution took place how many of the cabinet acted in their interest while you were there?

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Mr. Blount. I never saw any cabinet at all. I kept aloof from their politics. I stayed in that building away from the social life.

Senator Gray. Did you participate in the social life of the city?

Mr. Blount. Not at all, except I found myself bound to accept invitations from President Dole and other officials. And there was a Mr. Glade, a German, there, a member of the committee of safety, and the consul-general of Germany. I thought I could make a few calls of that sort—calling on the officials.

The Chairman. You say Mr. Glade was the consul-general of Germany, and still a member of the committee of safety?

Mr. Blount. He was a member of the committee of safety and a very active man in it.

Senator Dolph. Did you meet those who were members of the Queen's cabinet at the time the revolution took place?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

Senator Dolph. Talk with them?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

Senator Dolph. Did any of them defend the restoration of the Queen, defend her rights?

Mr. Blount. They were all for restoration, as I understood them?

Senator Dolph. All the members of the cabinet?

Mr. Blount. Yes. I think that will appear from the papers.

Senator Dolph. Were they examined before you?

Mr. Blount. I remember very distinctly Mr. Parker's examination. Whatever was done is in the record. As I say, I have not seen these papers in six months.

Senator Dolph. Did Mr. Nordhoff talk to you about this matter?

Mr. Blount. Mr. Nordhoff was like a good many other people; he would talk; but I did not confide in Mr. Nordhoff.

Senator Dolph. You listened to what he had to say ?

Mr. Blount. Oh, yes.

Senator Dolph. You did not disclose your instructions to him, but got what information you could from him?

Mr. Blount. I let him talk. He never stayed long; he would talk and go away.

Senator Dolph. Was anybody examined through Mr. Nordhoff?

Mr. Blount. No.

Senator Dolph. Any documents furnished you through him?

Mr. Blount. He brought me one day a letter from Dr. Trosseau, a physician there, the family physician of Mrs. Carter, an excellent lady (the wife of the ex-minister and sister of the chief justice and of Justice Bickerton, as I learned by accident). I think so; I have not had a chance to examine these papers. It seems to me that that paper this man sent to me—he wanted access to me, and he went to Nordhoff and Nordhoff wrote me a note inclosing these papers. They were in there. And it seems there was this communication from Nordhoff and a communication from this other man missing.

Senator Gray. There is a communication from a Frenchman who was the physician of this Queen as well as the other people.

Mr. Blount. There was a communication he sent. I did not like it. I never said a word to anybody about this paper from this physician, and I never sent for him. I made it a point not to get acquainted with him for some time after that occurred. For some time he used to come to the hotel, and for a long time I never met him. I did not care for anybody else to make suggestions. I said nothing to Mr. Nordhoff in any way about it; but I did not send for Dr. Trosseau. I did not like

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the paper. The paper I have in mind was in relation to the amount of distribution of the sugar stock—sugar interests of the royalists and annexationists. It occurred to me it was very plainly an unreliable statement, not that he meant to deceive, but he was a man of prejudices.

I did not care to examine him, because I thought that I could get persons whose judgment was better than Dr. Trousseau's. I do not mean to say he was not intelligent and a very fine physician—I knew nothing against him. I must add this qualification: Learning much later on that Trousseau and other persons were with the Queen when she learned of the landing of the troops, I sought from them the effect on her mind and on the minds of those about her. For this purpose I asked Dr. Trousseau to write me his recollections of this matter.

Adjourned to meet on Saturday, the 13th instant, at 10 o'clock a. m.


Washington, D. C, Saturday, January 13, 1894.

The subcommittee met pursuant to adjournment.

Present: The Chairman (Senator Morgan) and Senator Frye.

Absent: Senators Butler, Gray, and Sherman.

SWORN STATEMENT OF COMMANDER THEODORE F. JEWELL, U. S. NAVY.

The Chairman. Were you attached to the ship Boston in January, 1893?

Mr. Jewell. No.

The Chairman. Where were you when that ship was in Honolulu?

Mr. Jewell. I was here in Washington.

The Chairman. Have you ever visited the Hawaiian Islands?

Mr. Jewell. Yes; I was there twenty years ago, when Kalakaua was elected King.

The Chairman. To what ship were you attached then?

Mr. Jewell. The Tuscarora.

The Chairman. What was your rank and duty on that ship?

Mr. Jewell. My rank in the Navy was lieutenant-commander; I was executive officer of the ship Tuscarora.

Senator Frye. Do you mean that twenty years ago you were lieutenant- commander?

Mr. Jewell. Yes.

The Chairman. How long did the Tuscarora remain at Honolulu then?

Mr. Jewell. She was there six weeks. This is to the best of my recollection.

The Chairman. Did the Tuscarora get there before the election of the King, or after it had occurred?

Mr. Jewell. She arrived there the day before the death of the former King; she was there before the election of Kalakaua.

The Chairman. And during the time?

Mr. Jewell. And during the time.

The Chairman. Did you go on shore after the ship arrived in the harbor?

Mr. Jewell. I was on shore occasionally in Honolulu, but not very

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much. The executive officer of a ship is usually pretty well occupied, and I was ashore only once or twice during the time we stayed there.

The Chairman. Did you attend the meeting of the legislative body that elected Kalakaua King?

Mr. Jewell. No, I did not. I was on board the ship at that time.

The Chairman. The contest at that time was between Kalakaua and Queen Emma?

Mr. Jewell. Yes.

The Chairman. Did you ascertain whether the Americans there who claimed Hawaiian denizenship, as well as those who did not, were in favor of Kalakaua or Queen Emma?

Mr. Jewell. It was the general understanding that English influence was supporting Queen Emma and that the Americans were supporting Kalakaua.

The Chairman. That was a marked fact in the situation?

Mr. Jewell. Oh, no question about it.

The Chairman. Did the Americans there, to your knowledge, take any active part in agitations, commotions, or insurrections?

Mr. Jewell. Not at all; no.

The Chairman. They stood aloof?

Mr. Jewell. The riots which occurred during Kalakaua's election were entirely among the natives. There were a number of Americans who were in the Government at that time. The minister of foreign affairs was an American.

The Chairman. Do you recollect his name?

Mr. Jewell. Charles R. Bishop was his name. But I think there was nothing in the nature of inflammatory meetings previous to this election.

The Chairman. Were troops sent on shore from the Tuscarora?

Mr. Jewell. Yes.

The Chairman. Was there any other American ship in the harbor at that time?

Mr. Jewell. Yes, the sloop Portsmouth was there, and men were landed from both ships.

The Chairman. About what number?

Mr. Jewell. I commanded the forces that were landed from the Tuscarora, perhaps 80 men, and perhaps the same number from the Portsmouth.

The Chairman. When you landed did you go armed and equipped for fighting?

Mr. Jewell. Yes.

The Chairman. Did you take rations with you?

Mr. Jewell. No; we did not take rations, but we were in close communication with the ship all the time. As a matter of fact, we did not subsist ourselves on shore.

The Chairman. On whom did you subsist?

Mr. Jewell. The Hawaiian Government.

The Chairman. Did you go ashore on the invitation of the Hawaiian Government?

Mr. Jewell. Yes; as I understand, at the request of the cabinet in the interregnum between the death of Lunalilo and the election of Kalakaua. The Government requested that men be landed if a riot should occur. It was anticipated it would happen because of the one that occurred at the election of the other King the year before. Capt. Belknap, who was in command of the Tuscarora, and who was the senior officer there, made some arrangement with Mr. Pierce, the


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