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at all that led you to think that he was disposed to participate in Hawaiian politics, Hawaiian affairs?

Mr. Hobbs. No.

The Chairman. Interfere in the slightest degree with the independence of that country?

Mr. Hobbs. No.

The Chairman. You know Captain Wiltse well?

Mr. Hobbs. Very well.

The Chairman. Have you had frequent conversations with him?

Mr. Hobbs. Yes.

Senator Frye. Ss far as you know Captain Wiltse's purpose in landing troops was to protect the lives and property of Americans?

Mr. Hobbs. Yes.

The Chairman. Was that the understanding when the troops left the ship?

Mr. Hobbs. Yes.

The Chairman. To protect life and property?

Mr. Hobbs. The troops were ordered to take no side, but to remain passive in the troubles that were occurring—political troubles.

The Chairman. Could you detect any difference between the movement of the troops ashore from the Boston and the movement that took place twenty years ago, in 1874, when you were there, as to its purposes, objects, and motives?

Mr. Hobbs. I should say it was for the same reason.

The Chairman. So far as you know it all appeared to be for the same purpose?

Mr. Hobbs. Yes.

The Chairman. The preservation of life and property?

Mr. Hobbs. Exactly.

The Chairman. Did you have any suspicion or conjecture that those troops were sent there for the purpose of breaking up one government and erecting another?

Mr. Hobbs. Not the slightest. I did not know what was the purpose I did not figure it at all.

The Chairman. You did not think there was any such purpose?

Mr. Hobbs. No.

Adjourned to meet to-morrow, the 10th instant, at 10 o'clock a. m.

Wednesday, January 10, 1894.

The committee met pursuant to adjournment.

Present: The chairman (Senator Morgan) and Senators Gray and Frye.

Absent: Senators Butler and Sherman.


The Chairman. What is your rank in the Navy?

Mr. Laird. Lieutenant, senior grade.

The Chairman. When did you first visit the Hawaiian Islands?

Mr. Laird. On the arrival of the Boston there, August 24, 1892.

The Chairman. Were you much ashore after your arrival there?

Mr. Laird. Yes; most of the time when I was off duty I was ashore and met the people.


The Chairman. Did you have a great many acquaintances among them?

Mr. Laird. A great many.

The Chairman. What was the general state or condition of the people as to peacefulness and quietness after January, 1893?

Mr. Laird. It was generally quiet; but there was a great deal of tension on account of the numerous changes in the cabinet and the difficulties in the Legislature. At times in and about the club I would hear people, members of the Legislature, speak of the tension, and when the lottery bill was brought up for passage there was a great deal of tension amongst the people.

The Chairman. Do you mean that that occurred after the last change in the cabinet?

Mr. Laird. No; this was progressing with each change in the cabinet. The business portion of the community was more and more dissatisfied.

The Chairman. What cabinet was in when you went there—the Wilcox cabinet?

Mr. Laird. I can not tell. I know some of the members of the last cabinet. Mr. Parker was a member of the last cabinet.

Senator Gray. Who was that?

Mr. Laird. Sam Parker.

The Chairman. I think he was a member of the last cabinet?

Senator Frye. He was a member of the cabinet that displaced the Wilcox cabinet.

Mr. Laird. He was a member of the one that displaced the Wilcox cabinet—minister of foreign relations.

The Chairman. Did you know Mr. Parker?

Mr. Laird. Yes; very well.

The Chairman. Did you hear him speak of Hawaii and the various changes of the cabinet and the passage of the lottery and the opium bills?

Mr. Laird. I went to his house at various times, visited his family, and it was very seldom that he discussed politics. If he did it was in a light, frivolous way. He was 6 feet in height, but he had more of the characteristics of a child than of a full-grown man.

The Chairman. These discussions that you heard in the club were from other persons?

Mr. Laird. Yes; from other persons, people who would come there to get their luncheon.

The Chairman. Did you go with the Boston down to Hilo on that practice cruise?

Mr. Laird. Yes, I did.

The Chairman. When did you leave Honolulu?

Mr. Laird. We left on January 4 and returned on January 14.

The Chairman. At the time you left there were you aware of the existence of any public commotion or any threat against the integrity of the government, or opposition to it at all?

Mr. Laird. No. On the contrary, I was at a dinner with Mr. Irwin, who was Claus Spreckles's partner, and he expressed himself as being well satisfied with this new cabinet.

Senator Frye. That was the Wilcox cabinet?

Mr. Laird. Yes; Mr. Wilcox, from Hawaii; P. C. Jones, Mark Robinson, and Cecil Brown, all men of very high standing in the community.

Senator Frye. Was Mr. Irwin a man of wealth?


Mr. Laird. Yes; very large wealth; next to Mr. Spreckels the wealthiest man on the islands.

Senator Frye. What business has he there?

Mr. Laird. A large commercial business, and also president of the bank.

Senator Frye. Which bank?

Mr. Laird. Spreckels's bank.

The Chairman. So that at the time yon left there you had no apprehensions of a civil outbreak or political disturbance?

Mr. Laird. None whatever. The first intimation we had was after we got back to Lahaina, on the 13th.

The Chairman. What did you hear there?

Mr. Laird. Lahaina is about 85 miles from Honolulu. One of the inter-island steamers came in, and the purser and Mr. Wilder, now Hawaiian consul at San Francisco, came over and brought the latest paper, which gave the information that the Wilcox cabinet had been turned out and a new cabinet appointed, and that the Legislature was to be prorogued the next morning. This information was communicated to the captain and also to Mr. Stevens; the orders had been already given for sailing the next morning, and no change was made; we sailed at the time set, and went over very leisurely, half-steam power. On the way over a pet dog fell overboard, and we lowered the lifeboat and consumed about two hours looking for the dog. We arrived in the harbor the next morning about 11 o'clock. I did not finish mooring the ship until after 12. Mr. Young was the only one who went ashore to visit the Legislature.

The Chairman. And participated in the ceremony?

Mr. Laird. An invitation had been sent to the ship for the officers to attend the prorogation. But all the other officers were engaged that morning, or were taking their midday meal, and did not care to go, Mr. Young was the only one who went. Whether or not he was detailed by the captain I do not know.

The Chairman. Do you know whether Mr. Stevens or Mr. Young left the ship first?

Mr. Laird. I think Mr. Stevens left first; I am quite sure he did. As we came into the harbor his daughter was in a small pull-away boat with some gentlemen. They, pulled off to the ship, and Mr. Stevens went ashore probably a half hour before Mr. Young went.

The Chairman. This was the practice cruise that you made down on the coast at Hilo, the island at Hilo ?

Mr. Laird. Yes. Target practice had been delayed on account of the unsettled state of affairs in the harbor, and the captain decided to go to Hilo for target practice. During the time that we were there Mr. Stevens and his daughter went up to the volcano with some of the officers. We found the sea too rough at Hilo for target practice, and the captain decided to go to Lahaina aud hold target practice in the channel between the two islands, where we could get smooth water; we went back there and finished our practice on the afternoon of the 13th.

The Chairman. After your arrival at Honolulu, what time did you go ashore?

Mr. Laird. I did not go until Monday, when I landed with the troops. My duties were such that I could uot go ashore; we are not allowed to leave the ship whilst on duty, and I therefore did not go ashore.

The Chairman. Did you have command?


Mr. Laird. I did.

The Chairman. What command?

Mr. Laird. The color company.

The Chairman. Describe what you saw.

Mr. Laird. I was on duty Monday afternoon when preparations were being made for landing. Mr. Stevens came on board during the afternoon. At half-past 3, Lieut. Commander Swinburne, the executive officer, came and told me that he would send a relief for me, one of the junior officers, and that I should see that my company was equipped in heavy marching order, and see that all the accouterments were in good condition. I did so. Shortly after that, probably about 4 o'clock, all the officers who were to land were called into the cabin by Captain Wiltse and his instructions were read to the officers.

The Chairman. Before getting to the instructions I will ask, were any preparations made for sending detachments ashore before Mr. Stevens's arrival on board ship that afternoon?

Mr. Laird. They had been. Mr. Young had gone ashore, and he brought back certain rumors on Saturday. Time was consumed in getting the ammunition out of the ammunition room, the gun carriages into the boats, and ammunition in the belts. Each man had 80 rounds of ammunition, and each one of these had to be placed in the belt separately, the magazines had to be filled in anticipation of having to land; these preparations were made.

The Chairman. Before Mr. Stevens' arrival?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Frye. And in consequence of the various rumors?

Mr. Laird. The rumors that were passing around Saturday afternoon, Sunday, and Monday morning.

The Chairman. Do you mean that Mr. Young communicated these rumors to the captain?

Mr. Laird. He did communicate some; and other officers brought back such information as they found.

The Chairman. Do you know who they were.

Mr. Laird. I do not know.

The Chairman. Did any citizens come aboard ship before Mr. Stevens?

Mr. Laird. Not that I recollect.

The Chairman. Do you think you would have been aware of their presence if they had come?

Mr. Laird. I was officer of the deck. You mean Saturday.

The Chairman. On Monday morning. Mr. Stevens did not return until Monday afternoon?

Mr. Laird. He did not return until Monday afternoon.

The Chairman. I want to know if any citizen came aboad ship before Mr. Stevens came aboard.

Mr. Laird. That I can not state.

The Chairman. You were not officer of the deck?

Mr. Laird. I was officer of the deck in the afternoon, and I am quite sure none came.

The Chairman. What time did you go on duty?

Mr. Laird. At half past 12, and I was relieved at half past 3. If any citizens did come I did not see them. If any civilians came over the side and the quartermaster did not report to me he did not perform his duty. My duties would take me from the quarter-deck, and it would be the quartermaster's duty to report to me.

The Chairman. You were in charge of the color company?


Mr. Laird. Yes.

The Chairman. Bluejackets or marines?

Mr. Laird. Blue jackets.

The Chairman. Did you carry the national colors?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

The Chairman. You say that the officers were assembled in the cabin, and that Capt. Wiltse read his orders?

Mr. Laird. Yes, read the orders and instructions that were given to Mr. Swinburn. Mr. Stevens was sitting there at the time of this conference; and after a general discussion, into which I did not enter, I turned to Capt. Wiltse and asked him, "Now, Captain, how far will these orders and instructions which you have read, carry me in case I am detached from the main command and sent off to some other part of the city?" Capt. Wiltse turned to me and said, "My desire is that you remain neutral; you are to protect the lives and property of American citizens; you have been in Honolulu four months and have been going ashore and meeting the people and I must depend a great deal upon the discretion of my officers."

The Chairman. Was there anything in the orders or instructions you received that looked to the establishment of any government different from that of the Queen?

Mr. Laird. None. The burden of the orders was to look out for the lives and property of American citizens.

Senator Frye. And that order of Capt. Wiltse was given in the presence of Mr. Stevens?

Mr. Laird. It was.

The Chairman. Did Capt. Wiltse on that occasion read any order from the Secretary of the Navy or admiral of the fleet?

Mr. Laird. No; I do not think he had any communication from the admiral of the fleet.

The Chairman. Did he read any orders to him?

Mr. Laird. I think he read an extract. I do not know what the extracts were made from. I understood one of the extracts was taken from his letter of instructions from the Department; but I can not say where they were taken from.

The Chairman. The authority and the intervention he made there were discussed?

Mr. Laird. No; we did not discuss; we had not the right.

The Chairman. I mean, they were explained by him.

Mr. Laird. Yes. His explanation, after reading over these instructions, was general—that we were sent ashore for the protection of life and property of American citizens. That was the burden of it. The instructions were contained on a piece of paper the size of that (indicating an ordinary note sheet).

The Chairman. At the time you left the ship, had you any knowledge of the existence of a committee of safety in Honolulu?

Mr. Laird. I knew by hearsay that such a committee had been formed.

The Chairman. Did you know anything about the Provisional Government having been established ?

Mr. Young. No.

The Chairman. Your information was that there had been a committee of safety organized?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

The Chairman. Proceed and state how you landed and what you did over there.


Mr. Laird. The boats landed at Brewer's wharf at about quarter to 5. The battalion was formed on Queen street, marched up Queen to Fort street. On Fort street the battalion was halted in front of the U. S. consulate. Here the marines under command of Lieut. Draper were detached with instructions to protect the U. S. consulate and the U. S. legation.

The Chairman. Up what streets did you march?

Mr. Laird. Queen, Fort, Merchant, and King streets.

The Chairman. Abreast of the consulate, and there the detachment was made?

Mr. Laird. Yes, and there Mr. Draper was given orders to guard the consulate and to send part of his force up the valley to the minister's residence. About one-fifth of the whole command was detached.

The Chairman. So that the consulate was left in the hands of that officer?

Mr. Laird. Left in the hands of Mr. Draper.

The Chairman. Well?

Mr. Laird. The main body marched up Fort to Merchant, from Merchant to King, and out the King street road. The Queen was standing on the balcony of the palace as we passed. We gave the royal salute by drooping the colors and a blast from the trumpet. We went a half mile beyond the palace and came to the halt. There I went to Lieut. Commander Swinburne and said that something should be done to house the men, as the weather was threatening.

The Chairman. What time was that?

Mr. Laird. About half past 5 o'clock.

The Chairman. Was it dark?

Mr. Laird. It was not dark.

Senator Frye. Whom did you go to?

Mr. Laird. Lieut. Commander Swinburne; and he turned over the command of the infantry to me and went to see some of the citizens. Mr. Gunn was in the neighborhood, on horseback, and I think Mr. Charles Carter was there. Lieut. Commander Swinburne told me that Capt. Wiltse was down the street seeing if he could not find some covering for the men that night. When we went ashore we did not expect to remain more than a day or two at the most. We then marched up to Mr. Atherton's place, we stacked arms, and the men bivouacked there until 10 o'clock before a place was found.

Senator Frye. Did it rain?

Mr. Laird. It did; there were casual showers; quite a number of light showers passed over during the time we were there. We got under way about 10 o'clock and started down the street. In order not to make any disturbance, the music was stopped. We halted in front of Arion Hall. I did not know before that there was such a place. It is situated immediately back of the opera house on Palace Square. It was used as a Mormon church, and all the chairs and all the paraphernalia were on the floor. A detachment was sent in and the hall prepared for occupancy; the men spread their blankets on the floor and on the front and back verandas.

The Chairman. As you marched up the street during your progress there, did you see any bodies of people assembled anywhere?

Mr. Laird. No, not more than usual. Natives were grouped around, and there was quite a group around the palace gate. But I would not call it a body of people. They were immediately around the palace gate and Government building gate.

The Chairman. You speak of lolani Palace?

S. Doc. 231, pt 6----47


Mr. Laird. Yes.

The Chairman. How far is that building from the palace?

Mr. Laird. I suppose 150 yards.

The Chairman. Were there any persons in the palace enclosure beside the Queen?

Mr. Laird. I saw some members of the Queen's Guard. The gates were closed and 1 of the members of the guard was at the gate and 1 or 2 at the palace steps.

The Chairman. Was the Queen alone?

Mr. Laird. She was alone when I saw her on the balcony.

The Chairman. Was there any array of troops or policemen at the palace?

Mr. Laird. If there were I did not see them.

The Chairman. Were the persons around the palace numerous or scattering?

Mr. Laird. There were a great many more people on the street at that time of the evening than you would expect to find in Honolulu under ordinary circumstances.

The Chairman. I speak of the palace—immediately surrounding the palace. Were persons around there?

Mr. Laird. Directly in front of the palace, on the street, in the square there?

The Chairman. I am not speaking of that.

Mr. Laird. No; I did not see any one around the palace, except the guards of whom I spoke.

The Chairman. Guards at the step and one at the gate?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

The Chairman. Was there any alarm during the night?

Mr. Laird. I think there were two alarms of fire that night. Mr. Young had the guard. There were either two or three alarms of fire that night.

The Chairman. Did any men turn out?

Mr. Laird. I think Mr. Swinburne himself went out to see where it was, reconnoiter, and also sent an officer of the guard out.

The Chairman. Who was appointed officer of the day?

Mr. Laird. Mr. Young was officer of the day the day on which we landed.

The Chairman. The next morning, where did you go?

Mr. Laird. The next morning the regular routine was laid out— the men were confined in such a small place that it was necessary to keep them busy in order to keep them contented. The routine was laid out and continued there until we went down to Camp Boston.

The Chairman. How many days did you remain at Arion Hall?

Mr. Laird. Three days—three nights.

The Chairman. Then you went to Camp Boston?

Mr. Laird. Camp Boston.

The Chairman. How far away is that from Arion Hall?

Mr. Laird. Probably an eighth of a mile—little over.

The Chairman. Was that further from or nearer to the barracks than Arion Hall?

Mr. Laird. Further from the barracks; yes, decidedly.

The Chairman. And also the police station?

Mr. Laird. Nearer the police station.

The Chairman. How long did your detachment remain at Camp Boston after you got there?

Mr. Laird. Until 11 o'clock on the morning of April 1.


The Chairman. During the time you stayed there, were patrols sent out through the city?

Mr. Laird. Not for the purpose of patrolling the city. Men were sent out for drill in various directions in order to give them exercise but they were not sent out in the nature of a patrol.

The Chairman. Do you say there was no patrol established in Honolulu by your troops?

Mr. Laird. Not on the streets.

The Chairman. I mean outside of your own camp.

Mr. Laird. Not outside of our own camp.

The Chairman. You confined your duties to the protection of your camp?

Mr. Laird. Directly to having the men remain in camp, and no man was allowed to go out except on duty during the first two weeks we were there.

The Chairman. During that time was there turbulence in the city?

Mr. Laird. No; the city was quiet. There were a great many rumors of threatened action on the part of the Queen's followers; but there was no disorder of any kind.

The Chairman. Were you aware of any attempt at an opposition to the Provisional Government—I mean armed opposition?

Mr. Laird. There was not. I saw a number of rumors in that regard in the papers, but personally I was not aware of it.

The Chairman. At what time was the surrender of the Queen's military establishment made—troops and munitions of war?

Mr. Laird. That I can not state. I know they were the last to surrender. I think it was on the evening of the 18th.

The Chairman. Did they surrender after the police had surrendered that were under Wilson's command?

Mr. Laird. Yes. I think the Provisional Government allowed the Queen to retain them simply as a matter of courtesy, not that they feared them at all.

The Chairman. Betain the police?

Mr. Laird. No; retain her own personal guard. After they did surrender, a certain number was allowed to remain with her.

The Chairman. After the surrender took place?

Mr. Laird. After the surrender of the Queen's body guard they allowed her to retain a certain number.

Senator Gray. That was after her abdication?

Mr. Laird. Oh, certainly; some time after.

The Chairman. Were these men allowed to remain?

Mr. Laird. I do not know.

The Chairman. Were any police retained for the protection of her property?

Mr. Laird. Of the municipal police?

The Chairman. Yes.

Mr. Laird. I can not say. She was given all the protection that she required. If she did request a detail of police, I am quite sure it was given.

Senator Gray. Why are you sure; because of the general conduct of the Provisional Government?

Mr. Laird. They were very lenient.

Senator Gray. You knew what was going on with the Provisional Government.

Mr. Laird. Yes.


The Chairman. Were you present at the time Wilson gave up control of the police?

Mr. Laird. No.

The Chairman. Did you see them at any time in the city?

Mr. Laird. No. That was in an entirely different portion of the city than Arion Hall—half a mile away.

The Chairman. You confined yourself to your military duties while you were there?

Mr. Laird. Confined ourselves to the precincts of our own camp. Officers were not even permitted to go out; that is, during the first two days.

Senator Frye. Did you know Minister Stevens well?

Mr. Laird. Yes; I know him quite well. I have visited his family quite frequently and met him quite frequently.

Senator Frye. What estimate did you form of his character as a minister?

Mr. Laird. Remarkably good; think he was a man who was very attentive to his duties, and would consider him a very careful man.

Senator Frye. Did you see in him, or hear from him at any time in all your acquaintance with him, any purpose of overthrowing the existing Government of Hawaii and establishing a new one?

Mr. Laird. The only remarks I ever heard him make in regard to it was on the Boston down at Hilo. He lamented the general condition of the Government, and seemed to be relieved that the Wilcox cabinet had been formed.

Senator Frye. Did you have any conversations with Minister Stevens while he was on the ship going down to Hilo?

Mr. Laird. Quite a number; yes.

The Chairman. State whether or not he made any expressions about the continuance of the Wilcox cabinet—the length of time it would probably continue?

Mr. Laird. I feel confident that he expected thoroughly that the Wilcox cabinet would hold after the Legislature was prorogued.

Senator Frye. That was two years?

Mr. Laird. Yes, hold for two years until the next election. He spoke about the peace, the possibility of peace and quiet to the country, and his desires to wind up his affairs and go home.

Senator Frye. Was there any indication given to you or to any ot the officers in your presence, of a desire on the part of Mr. Stevens to interfere in the government of the islands?

Mr. Laird. None that I had ever seen.

Senator Frye. Do you yourself personally know what request Mr. Stevens made of Capt. Wiltse when he came on board the Boston that afternoon at 3 o'clock ?

Mr. Laird. I do not.

Senator Frye. Shortly after Minister Stevens came on board it was that in his presence and in the presence of all the officers that Capt. Wiltse issued the orders for shore duty and what should be done while on shore?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Frye. State whether or not while the troops were on shore there was any location of them made with any purpose of overawing the Queen or sustaining the Provisional Government?

Mr. Laird. None whatever. At the time the Provisional Government took charge I do not think there was anyone in the camp but Lieutenant Swinburne knew what was going to take place. They may


have known it, but I was officer of the day and I heard nothing about it. The men were on drill at the time the proclamation was read. We heard of that shortly afterward; but our drill continued, and when the policeman was shot down in the street I went to Lieut. Commander Swinburne and requested to take command of my own company, and that the men on guard for the day should be sent to the company, which was done. During the time of the reading of the proclamation drill was being held in the rear of the building; a number of the men on guard detail were lounging around on the front porch.

Senator Frye. State whether or not at anytime while you were on shore—during the four days of the revolution—your troops were allowed to march through the streets at all, except when you landed?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Frye. They were confined to their own barracks?

Mr. Laird. They were confined to their own quarters until after the third night.

Senator Frye. I mean during the time you were at Arion Hall.

Mr. Laird. Yes; we had dress parade immediately in front of the opera house; but they did not go away from that vicinity. There was not more than from three-quarters of an acre to an acre of ground back of Arion Hall, and we had to get the men out for exercise.

Senator Gray. That was the only place to drill?

Mr. Laird. The only place to drill.

Senator Gray. In front of the opera house?

Mr. Laird. In front of the opera house.

Senator Gray. In the street?

Mr. Laird. In the street. It was a triangular square.

Senator Frye. While you were there did you have any knowledge of the Queen's forces, both national guard and police? What did they amount to?

Mr. Laird. No; I did not.

Senator Frye. Was there any attempt while you were there made on the part of the Queen's troops to overturn the Provisional Government— to interfere with the mass meetings that were held?

Mr. Laird. None that I saw, and none that I heard of.

Senator Frye. Do you know of any officers or soldiers of the Boston who took any part whatever in the dethronement of the Queen?

Mr. Laird. None.

Senator Frye. Or in the establishment of the Provisional Government?

Mr. Laird. None.

Senator Gray. Where did you land?

Mr. Laird. We landed at Brewer's wharf.

Senator Gray. Please state where you marched.

Senator Frye. Show it by streets.

Senator Gray. Yes; call the streets, so that the stenographer may get them.

Mr. Laird. (indicating on the diagram). I do not think the street where we landed has any name. We landed at Brewer's wharf; we marched up through Merchant street.

Senator Gray. The whole battalion?

Mr. Laird. We formed on Queen street, and we marched down Queen street to Fort, and up Fort street to Merchant to the consulate; at the consulate the marines were detached.

Senator Gray. You marched down Queen street to Fort street to the consulate, where the marines were detached?


Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Gray. How many marines were there?

Mr. Laird. Thirty-six.

Senator Gray. Mr. Young said there were thirty-two.

Mr. Laird. Thirty-six would be the full company. We had music with us. They were one-fourth of the whole command.

Senator Gray. How much was the whole command?

Mr. Laird. One hundred and sixty-two.

Senator Gray. That is about a fifth.

Mr. Laird. About a fifth. We marched up Merchant street, passed the palace at King street, and went away out here to Mr. J. B. Atherton's.

Senator Gray. Who is he?

Mr. Laird. He is an American.

Senator Gray. What does he do.

Mr. Laird. He is an American citizen. I think he is a missionary.

Senator Gray. Are these squares all built up there?

Mr. Laird. They are very large holdings.

Senator Gray. Is it built up there?

Mr. Laird. The squares are not built up with houses.

Senator Sherman. This diagram shows the streets as they are improved. Where is Arion Hall?

Mr. Laird [indicating]. Right there.

Senator Gray. Is it built up in this part of the town; is that the thick part of the town?

Mr. Laird. No; this [indicating] is the thick part of the town, down here.

Senator Gray. You halted at Mr. Atherton's?

Mr. Laird. We halted once before getting to Mr. Atherton's.

Senator Sherman. Are all these houses [indicating]?

Mr. Laird. Yes; they are large houses, with the lots about them. The town is not thickly settled in that portion. Some distance past the palace we stopped halfway to Mr. Atherton's place, but it was some distance from the palace, so that we were entirely free from the palace or anything taking place at that time.

Senator Gray. Then you marched to Mr. Atherton's?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Gray. Then you halted for a considerable time because of the showers of rain?

Mr. Laird. Yes. We made one halt before getting there.

Senator Gray. Beyond the palace?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Gray. You marched there and stacked arms, and then went to the Government hall?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Gray. Did you fix the hour when you were present in the captain's cabin with the officers who were detailed for shore duty and Mr. Stevens?

Mr. Laird. It must have been about 4 o'clock, because I had been relieved a short time before, and I went down to pack my haversack, to make my preparations to go ashore when I was sent for.

Senator Gray. When you asked the captain for some instructions which he was giving you he applied himself to reading extracts from the general orders by the Secretary of the Navy?

Mr. Laird. He read that before, and he turned to me and gave the


instructions verbally in regard to placing a certain amount of discretion on his officers.

Senator Gray. Was that all the conversation that occurred at that time?

Mr. Laird. All that I recollect.

Senator Gray. Did he say anything to you about preventing fighting in the streets, or in your hearing say anything of that?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. Did Mr. Stevens go ashore before the troops did?

Mr. Laird. I could not say, because immediately afterward I went down to make my preparations for packing my knapsack and haversack, and did not go on deck until the troops were formed.

Senator Gray. Then, you have already said, or I understood you to say, that the military discipline was strict, and you and the other officers confined yourselves to military duties?

Mr. Laird. Military duties.

The Chairman. Did not interfere with the politics of the place?

Mr. Laird. The first two or three days we were not permitted to go out of the inclosure.

The Chairman. You confined yourself to military duties?

Mr. Laird. Entirely so.

The Chairman. And when the proclamation of the Provisional Government was being read you were engaged in assisting the drilling of the battalion in front of the Opera House?

Mr. Laird. No, not in front of the Opera House at the time; they were in this little narrow inclosure.

Senator Gray. I understood you to say that you drilled in front of the opera house.

Mr. Laird. No, some one asked if we marched down the street.

Senator Gray. You usually drilled in front of the opera house?

Mr. Laird. That was in parade or battalion drills.

Senator Gray. You were not there on Tuesday at any time in dress parade?

Senator Frye. At the time you took possession of the Government building?

Mr. Laird. We did not have dress parade that day.

Senator Gray. You landed there Monday. Did you have dress parade next day?

Mr. Laird. We did not.

Senator Gray. The only drill you had was that?

Mr. Laird. Back in this lot. The companies were being drilled independently by their own company officers.

Senator Gray. Did you have sentries posted around the outside?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Gray. Posts on the street?

Mr. Laird. Had regular posts.

Senator Gray. They were on the streets as well as in the inclosure?

Mr. Laird. They had to be, necessarily. There was only one sentry outside the line of the fence from the building itself. The picket fence was about as far as from here to the window [a distance of about 8 feet], and one sentry was posted out there to look out for our own people. The limits of his post were the front of the building.

Senator Gray. Did the Government hall touch on the street, or was it back inside the fence?

Mr. Laird. Inside the fence, and fronted a small alley-way. Here


is the main street [indicating]. This [indicating] is a narrow street, not much frequented.

Senator Gray. What sort of fence is there?

Mr. Laird. A picket fence on this side and a picket fence on both sides. There was a roadway that came down there from the opera house, and the Japanese commissioner lived in this house [indicating], so that we did not encroach upon his territory at all.

Senator Gray. There was a picket fence here [indicating]?

Mr. Laird. Our province was a little beyond the building itself.

Senator Gray. And the lot in which you were stationed was inclosed by a picket fence?

Mr. Laird. A picket fence, probably 4 or 5 feet in height.

Senator Gray. There was no disturbance that afternoon, Tuesday, after the proclamation of the Provisional Government, and around in the neighborhood of where you were?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. Around the Government building?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. Were you in a place to have seen it if there had been?

Mr. Laird. After the drill was over I walked out in front, in the roadway, to see if there was any assemblage of people.

Senator Gray. Were you aware that the proclamation was being read?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. You did not see any of it?

Mr. Laird. Did not see it and did not know it.

Senator Gray. Until you were told?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Gray. There was no disturbance there?

Mr. Laird. No.

Senator Frye. Was there any difficulty that night about finding quarters for your troops?

Mr. Laird. There must have been great difficulty, or the men would not have been kept out until half past 9.

Senator Frye. Were there men out seeking quarters?

Mr. Laird. Yes.

Senator Frye. And you did not get them until 9 o'clock?

Mr. Laird. It was later than that.

Senator Frye. Do you know whether Arion Hall was selected with any reference at all to the Queen's Government or Provisional Government?

Mr. Laird. I have no such knowledge. I do not think it was. It was accidental—it was available.

Senator Frye. And the only one, so far as you could find out, that was available? Was there anything in the location or disposition of the troops which prevented the Queen's troops from dislodging the men who took possession of the Government buildings?

Mr. Laird. No, I do not think there was.

Senator Frye. Under your orders, if the Queen's troops had undertaken to repossess themselves of the Government buildings, had you any right to interfere?

Mr. Laird. I would have been obliged to obey Mr. Swinburne's orders.

Senator Frye. I say, under the instructions?

Mr. Laird. Under the instructions, no.

Senator Frye. In Mr. Blount's report he states that the Queen's


troops could not have done anything touching the Government buildings really without firing upon the American troops.

Senator Gray. Quoting Admiral Skerrett for that opinion.

Senator Frye. No; I do not think Admiral Skerrett gives that as his opinion.

Mr. Laird. I do not see how we could interfere in any way with the Queen's forces or Government forces.

Senator Frye. I do not, from the maps, if the maps are correct. Did you at any time while you were there learn the extent of the Queen's troops and the Queen's police?

Mr. Laird. No, I did not.

Senator Gray. Did you intend to allow any fighting over across the street from you?

Mr. Laird. I was under the immediate orders of Lieut. Swinburne at the time, and I would have been obliged to obey his instructions. I could not use my own judgment; he was the senior officer.

Senator Gray. How long did you stay on shore?

Mr. Laird. We were on shore from the 16th of January until the 1st of April.

Senator Gray. How far was Camp Boston from the landing place?

Mr. Laird. It was right in the heart of the city itself.

Adjourned until to-morrow, 11th instant, at 10 o'clock a. m.

Washington, D. C., January 11, 1894.

The subcommittee met pursuant to adjournment.

Present: The Chairman (Senator Morgan) and Senators Butler, Gray, and Senator Dolph of the full committee.

Absent: Senators Sherman and Frye.


The Chairman. What time were you first informed of your selection by the President as the Commissioner to go to Hawaii?

Mr. Blount. The first intimation I had on the subject of my going to the Hawaiian Islands is contained in this dispatch, which I read:

"Washington, D. C., March 10,1893.
"Hon. James H. Blount,
Macon, Ga.:
"By authority I ask can you come here immediately prepared for confidential trip of great importance into Pacific Ocean? Answer."

The Chairman. Was that signed by Mr. Gresham?

Mr. Blount. No; by Hoke Smith.

The Chairman. You came in accordance with that request?

Mr. Blount. Yes. And if you will allow me I would say when I first got the telegram I made up my mind very promptly that I would not go; I did not want to go at all. My son opened the dispatch and found out what it was, and in that way was induced to bring it up to my house. I was at home. He asked me what I was going to do about it, and I said I was not going. I then showed it to his mother, and told her that I was not going. After some little while my son said, "Father, mother's health is very bad, and I think it would add five years to her life to go;" and under that appeal from him I said, "I will do anything for your mother's benefit; I will go." I then sent

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